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A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - Printable Version

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+--- Thread: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! (/showthread.php?tid=3042)

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RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - iheartboost - 11-11-2011

YEA! that would be so awesome to have an STD meet at his place


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - Captain America - 11-11-2011

(11-11-2011, 06:53 PM)DeliveryValve
(11-11-2011, 05:43 PM)Captain America This is exciting!

Damn exciting! I wish he was stateside! We'd all have a GTG at his shop!
.

most definitely! Need to get some 617 pumps going!


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - dieselmeken - 11-12-2011

You are all welcome to a GTG at my workshop, however it will be a long trip for you all.
I was planning a trip to the USA last year, but we ended up in Thailand with my whole family.
My little wife, Eva & myself will do this trip soon, dont know when, but its going to happend sometime. the plan is San Fransisco-LA -Las Vegas _ LA- Hawaii- home. Is 3 weeks enough? If someone of you need a pump an lives there, can we make a switch? I fix the pump, You lend me the car?

For those who are intrested I can say that the shippingcost of one pump from Sweden to Irland is 40 euro with DHL Ecomnomyclass or whatever it was.
I have a customnumber there, sending all my pumps in Sweden with DHL, the are the cheepest so far.

(11-11-2011, 10:09 PM)Captain America
(11-11-2011, 06:53 PM)DeliveryValve
(11-11-2011, 05:43 PM)Captain America This is exciting!

Damn exciting! I wish he was stateside! We'd all have a GTG at his shop!
.

most definitely! Need to get some 617 pumps going!




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - iheartboost - 11-12-2011

40 euros is alot less than I thought it would be to ship a pump to sweden. Too bad I dont live on the west coast lol. it would be cool to meet you.


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - Captain America - 11-13-2011

I live 50 miles from LA! Would be more than willing to lend you my car!


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - sassparilla_kid - 11-13-2011

I live less than 3 hours from San Francisco, and less than 5 hours from LA, probably the only good thing about living in fresno is that it is right in the very middle of the state lol


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-13-2011

(11-12-2011, 11:15 AM)dieselmeken You are all welcome to a GTG at my workshop, however it will be a long trip for you all.
I was planning a trip to the USA last year, but we ended up in Thailand with my whole family.
My little wife, Eva & myself will do this trip soon, dont know when, but its going to happend sometime. the plan is San Fransisco-LA -Las Vegas _ LA- Hawaii- home. Is 3 weeks enough? If someone of you need a pump an lives there, can we make a switch? I fix the pump, You lend me the car?

For those who are intrested I can say that the shippingcost of one pump from Sweden to Irland is 40 euro with DHL Ecomnomyclass or whatever it was.
I have a customnumber there, sending all my pumps in Sweden with DHL, the are the cheepest so far.

(11-11-2011, 10:09 PM)Captain America
(11-11-2011, 06:53 PM)DeliveryValve Damn exciting! I wish he was stateside! We'd all have a GTG at his shop!
.

most definitely! Need to get some 617 pumps going!
hi,
if you ever decide to come to Ireland on holiday i will lend you my car.

wayne




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-15-2011

hi,

look what i have:

[Image: utf-8BSU1HMDA2MTItMjAxMTExMTUtMTgyOS5qcGc.jpg]


santa claus has come early lol.


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - dieselmeken - 11-15-2011

SmileSmile Smile
over 2400 wiews in this topic now tells me there is a intrest in this challange
And a 5 star raiting

Now I and sure some more from over there waiting to hear the sound.
Come back to me when you have fired the engine up and done some testing.

Pretty fast delivery for 40 euro, dont you think so?


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - drumbreda - 11-15-2011

(11-15-2011, 03:10 PM)mantahead hi,

look what i have:

[Image: utf-8BSU1HMDA2MTItMjAxMTExMTUtMTgyOS5qcGc.jpg]


santa claus has come early lol.

Thats over an hour ago and i cant hear any noise yet!
chop chop




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - Captain America - 11-15-2011

(11-15-2011, 03:34 PM)dieselmeken SmileSmile Smile
over 2400 wiews in this topic now tells me there is a intrest in this challange
And a 5 star raiting

Now I and sure some more from over there waiting to hear the sound.
Come back to me when you have fired the engine up and done some testing.

Pretty fast delivery for 40 euro, dont you think so?

I voted it 5 stars! I think I was the first Cool Big Grin Tongue Wink


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-15-2011

hi,
no noise tonight, pump is fitted (in the dark), battery went dead and spare battery dead also.
will have to wait to tomorrow

wayne


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - iheartboost - 11-15-2011

OMG! im so stoked! and man thats a beautiful pump Wink gonna be awesome


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - sassparilla_kid - 11-16-2011

That thing looks awesome, I think I need to get one now lol


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - George3soccer - 11-16-2011

intrest, yhus. now lets get these pumps out the door.


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - dieselmeken - 11-16-2011

waiting waiting waiting.................
8 votes, 4,5 out of 5 stars, come on and vote now. ( who is NOT intrested in this?)


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - jonbobshinigin - 11-16-2011

You are really giving us some good insight and understanding of what all is involved in tuning these pumps. I guess other tuners are concerned about losing business from sharing the data, but after seeing these clips, I doubt I would ever try it myself.

When do you expect the 603 pumps to be available? You should start collecting them right now because I imagine most of us will want to keep our stock pumps...at least that is how I plan on doing mine ;-)


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - aaa - 11-16-2011

I'd contribute to a spare pump pool.


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - w123love - 11-17-2011

the plan is San Fransisco-LA -Las Vegas _ LA- Hawaii- home. Is 3 weeks enough? If someone of you need a pump an lives there, can we make a switch? I fix the pump, You lend me the car?



I have most definitely have a w123 for you and the family Mr. Dieselmeken! I am the most Southern of all these west coast guys but there is one here for you!


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - dieselmeken - 11-17-2011

A small teaser here from a pm from mantahead.


It pulls well on dyno, saw 3 bar of boost, never done that before Big Grin
It was actually spinning the tyres on dyno when it came on boost, the lads never seen that before.



Now some small adjustments are to be made, Mantahead & myself will come back when it works out the way it was ment to bee.



RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - hansebanger77 - 11-17-2011

wow 3 bar boost Big Grin how long will it hold? Smile



RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - Palmer - 11-17-2011

(11-17-2011, 05:17 AM)hansebanger77 wow 3 bar boost Big Grin how long will it hold? Smile

Well he was running 2.7 before and tramped on it all day at drift tracks / events so im guessing alllllll day! Wink


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - hansebanger77 - 11-17-2011

(11-17-2011, 06:59 AM)Palmer
(11-17-2011, 05:17 AM)hansebanger77 wow 3 bar boost Big Grin how long will it hold? Smile

Well he was running 2.7 before and tramped on it all day at drift tracks / events so im guessing alllllll day! Wink

then I should turn the screw for fuel Smile
have much in reserve. I can hardly restrain myself. But the risk that again everything flies into the air ... : D so much work again....

but still great work to Mr. Dieselmeken!! good job!
and good luck to Mantahead for some adjustments!


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-17-2011

hi,
i have been very busy at work so have not had a lot of time at the merc.
Got the pump fitted and went to the dyno.

Dieselmeken 1
Electronic pump 0

He has won the challange, today we saw more power than the electronic pump and with a very long power band.
I have still a timing problem so i should see more power.
I don't want to post any results up yet as i'm not finished testing on the dyno.
When i get the results you all will be the first to know.
I promise a video and results.

wayne


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-17-2011

(11-17-2011, 03:36 PM)mantahead hi,
i have been very busy at work so have not had a lot of time at the merc.
Got the pump fitted and went to the dyno.

Dieselmeken 1
Electronic pump 0

He has won the challange, today we saw more power than the electronic pump and with a very long power band.
I have still a timing problem so i should see more power.
I don't want to post any results up yet as i'm not finished testing on the dyno.
When i get the results you all will be the first to know.
I promise a video and results.

wayne
also,
thanks to ELITE MOTOR PERFORMANCE in Armagh for the use of the Dyno Dynamics rolling road.




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-18-2011

hi,
no videos yet but i will sort that out.
I have been working with timing and adjusting and checking on dyno etc.
Max power was made today
[Image: utf-8BSU1HMDA2MjItMjAxMTExMTgtMjEzNC5qcGc.jpg]

The 370hp run is from the electronic pump.
The 385hp is from the challange pump (dieselmeken tuned pump)
The 383hp is from the challange pump which i pushed the rev limit to show how it still supplys diesel to 6600rpm

Congratulations to Dieselmeken.

You will notice these dyno runs have different spool up from the first runs at the start of this thread. This is because the first graphs where based on half the exhaust housing blocked of and where running 2.7 bar.
I tried the challange pump with this setup and because of the extra fuel (and no wastegate) i saw 3.3 bar and the boost pipe hit the wall of the garage lol and wheel spin on the dyno.
So i unblocked the exhaust housing and compared results to the 370hp run i had from the electronic pump under the same conditions.
My restriction is my exhaust manifold which is a standard one modified. Think i have too much back pressure.

wayne


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - DeliveryValve - 11-18-2011

WOW!





.


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - iheartboost - 11-18-2011

YAY!! Big Grin



RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - jonbobshinigin - 11-18-2011

So what else is required for you to make it closer to the 450hp mark you were aiming for? Is it even possible on this platform?


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - tomnik - 11-19-2011

Good job!

it seems that the air flow is o.k. up to 5300-5500, beyond that no extra air is possible and thus no extra power even there is fuel.
I wonder if it was necessary to reduce the fly weights for this current set up.
Is this car still drivable in traffic?
What was EGT?

Tom


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - sassparilla_kid - 11-19-2011

That's awesome, if my car had half of that power I would be happy!!


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - dieselmeken - 11-19-2011

The tomnikelement are pushing max in this pump, no more to get there, Another type of element@ more fuel and the 450hp mark is possible.

I am the winner in this challange, hooray for meSmileSmile
You are all winners when you work with me, hooray for youSmileSmile


(11-18-2011, 10:35 PM)jonbobshinigin So what else is required for you to make it closer to the 450hp mark you were aiming for? Is it even possible on this platform?





RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - jeemu - 11-19-2011

Why that much boost? That power come easily less than 2bar boost.


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-19-2011

hi,
i think my standard exhaust manifold is causing back pressure issues. I need to get a gauge and make a manifold. I am also waiting on a 12cm housing.

hi Jeemu, i was making this boost because i have no wastegate yet. I didn't really need one with electronic pump. The fact that i can make more boost must mean i have enough fuel.
What you think?
What power should hx35 make with standard engine and with how many cc of fuel?
I have experience with different dyno's and i know for a fact if i used inerita dyno like yours i would make over 400hp with this setup.
Let me know what you think as i know you have more knowledge on this than i have.

wayne


hi Tom,
i wanted the flyweights lightened for a longer power band, this is so much easier to drift. Even if this had less power than electronic pump it would be better with more revs.
Still drivable for me. Now that timing is right egt went to max of 650c.
Exhaust manifold is next, i read on here one time that stock manifold was only good for 300hp.

wayne


(11-19-2011, 12:40 AM)tomnik Good job!

it seems that the air flow is o.k. up to 5300-5500, beyond that no extra air is possible and thus no extra power even there is fuel.
I wonder if it was necessary to reduce the fly weights for this current set up.
Is this car still drivable in traffic?
What was EGT?

Tom




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - iheartboost - 11-19-2011

I WANT DYNO RUNS! please Big Grin


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - tomnik - 11-19-2011

Göran,

do you think that the pump ran out of fuel beyond 5500/min?
You should be able to answer this as you had the pump on the bench.

Where do you want to go with plunger diameter for more fuel?
Or do you want to increase duration further?

A good sign is that EGTs are still safe.

Tom

(11-19-2011, 02:31 AM)dieselmeken The tomnikelement are pushing max in this pump, no more to get there, Another type of element@ more fuel and the 450hp mark is possible.

I am the winner in this challange, hooray for meSmileSmile
You are all winners when you work with me, hooray for youSmileSmile


(11-18-2011, 10:35 PM)jonbobshinigin So what else is required for you to make it closer to the 450hp mark you were aiming for? Is it even possible on this platform?




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - dieselmeken - 11-19-2011

No, not diameter, a different barrel is the solution


(11-19-2011, 02:25 PM)tomnik Göran,

do you think that the pump ran out of fuel beyond 5500/min?
You should be able to answer this as you had the pump on the bench.

Where do you want to go with plunger diameter for more fuel?
Or do you want to increase duration further?

A good sign is that EGTs are still safe.

Tom

(11-19-2011, 02:31 AM)dieselmeken The tomnikelement are pushing max in this pump, no more to get there, Another type of element@ more fuel and the 450hp mark is possible.

I am the winner in this challange, hooray for meSmileSmile
You are all winners when you work with me, hooray for youSmileSmile


(11-18-2011, 10:35 PM)jonbobshinigin So what else is required for you to make it closer to the 450hp mark you were aiming for? Is it even possible on this platform?




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-19-2011

hi,
so do you guys think i have a diesel problem or airflow?
I didn't think the standard engine was going to make max power any higher than 5500rpm. It would need cams and stronger valve springs etc.
Jeemu would be a good man to ask here. What you's think?

wayne


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - tomnik - 11-20-2011

(11-19-2011, 04:48 PM)mantahead hi,
so do you guys think i have a diesel problem or airflow?
I didn't think the standard engine was going to make max power any higher than 5500rpm. It would need cams and stronger valve springs etc.
Jeemu would be a good man to ask here. What you's think?

wayne

Hi,

we can see that something happens at 5500.
It is likely not the governor although it is not clear on the video.

An easy test is to install temporarily just a downpipe to reduce back pressure.

Another theory is that cams float, either in the engine itself or in the pump or even the elements can not be filled that fast.

Wayne, is the pump still on max. delivery adjustment as Göran had in the video?

Jeemu, what is your comment?

Tom


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - erling66 - 11-20-2011

Hi Mantahead
Thanks for sharing your experience with usSmile
My guess is that your stock manifold is the problem. You need to get the exhaust out of the cylinders. More fuel + boost means more exhaust but your manifold can't flow more when the revs go up. So please change that and nothing else. It will be very interesting to see the difference.


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - dieselmeken - 11-20-2011

No Wayne, You dont have any problems, as long as you are satisfied thats ok for me. 385hp from 4500 to 6600 rpm, Not many that can beat that in a 605 engine. Its one thing to write down on a forum that my engine has so and so many hp, Another thing to show it with a dynoresult. Great job!

If we calculate a bit and playing with the idea that we have a pump that give you 170cc instead if the 150cc pump, you would end up in maybee 430hp, In theory that is, if it was a 606 engine 525hp, Is that bad?
If I give you 200cc God knows whats going to happens....
The 605 pump I did with 6 mm element, 120cc of fuel was 274hp, just as a comparison.
http://www.maxxtuning.se/kundbilar/effektmatning-orginal-ecu/232whp-mercedes-w123--jim/
But its not all about the fuel, thats important.
You wrote also that the bench did measure lower power than the others, I dont know the different between dynos, but in that case you must be very glad for this.

Now,up with som nice filmclip when you drifting, I want to hear the engine roar.

(11-19-2011, 04:48 PM)mantahead hi,
so do you guys think i have a diesel problem or airflow?
I didn't think the standard engine was going to make max power any higher than 5500rpm. It would need cams and stronger valve springs etc.
Jeemu would be a good man to ask here. What you's think?

wayne




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - tomnik - 11-20-2011

without any doubt the power is great but we try to understand what is happening at 5500.
In case it is limited air flow (exhaust) more ccm will not be the best solution.
ccm is about proportional with hp if you can burn the fuel.
According to my understanding the engine is fine up to 5500.

The easiest way to check is probably to install a short down pipe until your 200 ccm pump is available.

Tom



RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - majesty78 - 11-20-2011

If its limiting by EMP, a changed downpipe wont help much...


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - tomnik - 11-20-2011

mechanical pump.

(11-20-2011, 07:37 AM)majesty78 If its limiting by EMP, a changed downpipe wont help much...




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-20-2011

hi Tom,
is it more on the 385hp run you see the problem, if so; i think my extraction system melted and closed over blocking the exhaust on this run.
Anyone any dyno graphs on completly standard om605 running this power or even more to compare results at 5500rpm???

wayne


(11-20-2011, 07:25 AM)tomnik without any doubt the power is great but we try to understand what is happening at 5500.
In case it is limited air flow (exhaust) more ccm will not be the best solution.
ccm is about proportional with hp if you can burn the fuel.
According to my understanding the engine is fine up to 5500.

The easiest way to check is probably to install a short down pipe until your 200 ccm pump is available.

Tom




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - OM616 - 11-20-2011

Something to also consider is if the Delivery valves are floating at such high delivery quantities and speeds. If they can't keep up, the injection stability, (timing, quantity, and quality), would be affected.

The settings this pump is set up with, and top operating speeds are way outside what the DVs were calibrated for. Just a thought.



RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - jeemu - 11-20-2011

How much ip give fuel?
What kind lift pump? Measured pressure?

Throw that original ex manifold on the river and make better one

You can "feel" if there is too much backpressure No gauge needed Big Grin


RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - mantahead - 11-20-2011

(11-20-2011, 03:57 PM)jeemu How much ip give fuel?
What kind lift pump? Measured pressure?

Throw that original ex manifold on the river and make better one

You can "feel" if there is too much backpressure No gauge needed Big Grin
hi,
i think it was 158cc fuel
Electric inline pump, 2.5 bar pressure, 12mm fuel lines to tank.
Filter housing of a truck with twin filters.
yea man i'm going to make manifold very soon. would you recommend a log type manifold or not?

wayne




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - drumbreda - 11-20-2011

a small video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GITi-n9ZTU




RE: A CHALLANGE FOR DIESELMEKEN !!! - iheartboost - 11-20-2011

YEAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!

is this still auto or is it a manual?