EMS for electronic OM606 engines
EMS for electronic OM606 engines
Some folks already know that I have been working on fitting an OM606 into a w201 chassis. Most of that time dealt with designing a engine management system (EMS) for the 99 606.962 engine (it will work on other years as well), that employs an electronically controlled injection pump. I do have a spare mechanical 603 pump ready to install, but I really wanted to try to get the electronic pump to work. Well the other day...
I got the 606 started! The standalone EMS employs feedback for the rpms, so that you have an idle. After all the hard work it was a great relief when I got it to easily start, and idle on it's own! The idle can be set to whatever you like (within reason), and any load placed upon the engine like A/C, etc, will automatically be compensated for. In addition, the rev limit can be set as well, and a custom fuel curve can be adjusted for full ALDA functionality.
I am very impressed how fast the 606 revs up! Granted, it only has a flexplate right now, but impressive none the less, and the sound! I did not get a chance to make a video, and now I have to deal with a sticking injector that needs a new nozzle. Of course, the lower injector body/holder cracked when opening it up to get to the nozzle, so now I need a whole injector. The reflection on the pintle shows the flat spot
Any ideas on how to get one, or does anyone have a spare?
The EMS will be available, once I get the code where I want it in terms of excellent engine performance.
Later, Tomnik's 7.5mm elements will be swapped into this pump for even more fun This should require no retuning, since the EMS compensates for rpm, but I might need to alter the fuel delivery curve for the alda!
More to follow when I get the new injector, but here a few photos for now from a cell camera. Enjoy!
Sounds sweet! Will you be willing to release any source code? Are you designing your own circuits or using something pre-existing?
(04-30-2010, 09:45 PM)300SD81 Sounds sweet! Will you be willing to release any source code? Are you designing your own circuits or using something pre-existing?
(05-01-2010, 01:05 PM)muuris Wow, that's sweet. But since you made this thread, you've got to give us something about the EMS
Thanks, it was a lot of hard work, and I am very happy with the results. There were times when I thought it was not going to work but, persistence paid off
I designed the code and circuit design, and I am still tweaking both for optimal performance. I am not sure if I will release anything yet, but I might. I am just glad it works!
(04-30-2010, 09:45 PM)300SD81 Sounds sweet! Will you be willing to release any source code? Are you designing your own circuits or using something pre-existing?
(05-01-2010, 01:05 PM)muuris Wow, that's sweet. But since you made this thread, you've got to give us something about the EMS
Was it you that had plans to make an electronically controlled MW as well? I seem to remember someone posting about potentially making an adapter plate to mate the electronic M governor to a MW.
Also, would you mind disclosing what kind of CPU you are using so I can get an idea of what kind of clock speeds/capabilities it'd need? I've wanted to attempt something similar for a while now, but can't justify buying an electronic pump just to play around with...
How far have you gone with your system? Does it have ALDA functionality? Does it interface with the trans at all? Cruise control? EGT protection?
Also would love to know what hardware you used and software details. I can understand if you want to keep secrets for the purpose selling things though. I only ask because I have been mulling over an MW EMS for a short while.
(05-01-2010, 07:04 PM)300SD81 Was it you that had plans to make an electronically controlled MW as well? I seem to remember someone posting about potentially making an adapter plate to mate the electronic M governor to a MW.
Also, would you mind disclosing what kind of CPU you are using so I can get an idea of what kind of clock speeds/capabilities it'd need? I've wanted to attempt something similar for a while now, but can't justify buying an electronic pump just to play around with...
(05-01-2010, 08:09 PM)GREASY_BEAST How far have you gone with your system? Does it have ALDA functionality? Does it interface with the trans at all? Cruise control? EGT protection?
Also would love to know what hardware you used and software details. I can understand if you want to keep secrets for the purpose selling things though. I only ask because I have been mulling over an MW EMS for a short while.
It might also be good for the EMS to keep track of oil pressure. That way it can limit torque intelligently, as well as have an auto-shutdown if something goes bad.
It was not me, I think it was Greasy_Beast. It is a neat project, however, and it should be totally possible to do. The adapter plate would not be all that difficult to make, and there are a variety of Mercedes (application) electronic pumps you could scavenge the governor from (om605, etc).
In addition, this EMS should also be able to control the pump for an om605 as well.
I think I will keep that information for now, and if I do end up making the EMS available for sale, it will be very reasonable. The main goal for the project was simply to be able to use the engine as is, not to make a lot of $.
(05-01-2010, 07:04 PM)300SD81 Was it you that had plans to make an electronically controlled MW as well? I seem to remember someone posting about potentially making an adapter plate to mate the electronic M governor to a MW.
Also, would you mind disclosing what kind of CPU you are using so I can get an idea of what kind of clock speeds/capabilities it'd need? I've wanted to attempt something similar for a while now, but can't justify buying an electronic pump just to play around with...
(05-01-2010, 08:09 PM)GREASY_BEAST How far have you gone with your system? Does it have ALDA functionality? Does it interface with the trans at all? Cruise control? EGT protection?
Also would love to know what hardware you used and software details. I can understand if you want to keep secrets for the purpose selling things though. I only ask because I have been mulling over an MW EMS for a short while.
It might also be good for the EMS to keep track of oil pressure. That way it can limit torque intelligently, as well as have an auto-shutdown if something goes bad.
(05-04-2010, 10:28 AM)DervTuning It was not me, I think it was Greasy_Beast. It is a neat project, however, and it should be totally possible to do. The adapter plate would not be all that difficult to make, and there are a variety of Mercedes (application) electronic pumps you could scavenge the governor from (om605, etc).
In addition, this EMS should also be able to control the pump for an om605 as well.
I think I will keep that information for now, and if I do end up making the EMS available for sale, it will be very reasonable. The main goal for the project was simply to be able to use the engineas is, not to make a lot of $.
(05-01-2010, 07:04 PM)300SD81 Was it you that had plans to make an electronically controlled MW as well? I seem to remember someone posting about potentially making an adapter plate to mate the electronic M governor to a MW.
Also, would you mind disclosing what kind of CPU you are using so I can get an idea of what kind of clock speeds/capabilities it'd need? I've wanted to attempt something similar for a while now, but can't justify buying an electronic pump just to play around with...
Yes, the EMS does have full alda functionality, and you will be able to tune it whilst driving, making the process for finding the optimal fuel delivery curve fast and easy.
There is no transmission interface, as I will be using the Getrag 5MT from the 16 valve. Cruise control could be fairly simple to enable, with a defeat coming from the brake lamp signal, and/or switch. EGT protection is something I want to add as well, for the gauge I will use is a peak hold type with an alarm output. The EMS can take this as an input, limiting the fuel delivery to a safe level, seamlessly.
That is a good idea about the oil pressure, thanks! It should be able to interface the oil pressure sensor signal to limit the fuel to the idle setting or shut the engine off completely.
Does anyone know the pinout for the factory glow plug relay for the 99 E300TD? I just need to know about the 3 pin terminal on the relay. My guess is power, ground, and temperature or indicator lamp, but I am not sure 100%.
(05-01-2010, 08:09 PM)GREASY_BEAST How far have you gone with your system? Does it have ALDA functionality? Does it interface with the trans at all? Cruise control? EGT protection?
Also would love to know what hardware you used and software details. I can understand if you want to keep secrets for the purpose selling things though. I only ask because I have been mulling over an MW EMS for a short while.
It might also be good for the EMS to keep track of oil pressure. That way it can limit torque intelligently, as well as have an auto-shutdown if something goes bad.
(05-04-2010, 10:28 AM)DervTuning It was not me, I think it was Greasy_Beast. It is a neat project, however, and it should be totally possible to do. The adapter plate would not be all that difficult to make, and there are a variety of Mercedes (application) electronic pumps you could scavenge the governor from (om605, etc).
In addition, this EMS should also be able to control the pump for an om605 as well.
I think I will keep that information for now, and if I do end up making the EMS available for sale, it will be very reasonable. The main goal for the project was simply to be able to use the engineas is, not to make a lot of $.
(05-01-2010, 07:04 PM)300SD81 Was it you that had plans to make an electronically controlled MW as well? I seem to remember someone posting about potentially making an adapter plate to mate the electronic M governor to a MW.
Also, would you mind disclosing what kind of CPU you are using so I can get an idea of what kind of clock speeds/capabilities it'd need? I've wanted to attempt something similar for a while now, but can't justify buying an electronic pump just to play around with...
Yes, the EMS does have full alda functionality, and you will be able to tune it whilst driving, making the process for finding the optimal fuel delivery curve fast and easy.
There is no transmission interface, as I will be using the Getrag 5MT from the 16 valve. Cruise control could be fairly simple to enable, with a defeat coming from the brake lamp signal, and/or switch. EGT protection is something I want to add as well, for the gauge I will use is a peak hold type with an alarm output. The EMS can take this as an input, limiting the fuel delivery to a safe level, seamlessly.
That is a good idea about the oil pressure, thanks! It should be able to interface the oil pressure sensor signal to limit the fuel to the idle setting or shut the engine off completely.
Does anyone know the pinout for the factory glow plug relay for the 99 E300TD? I just need to know about the 3 pin terminal on the relay. My guess is power, ground, and temperature or indicator lamp, but I am not sure 100%.
(05-01-2010, 08:09 PM)GREASY_BEAST How far have you gone with your system? Does it have ALDA functionality? Does it interface with the trans at all? Cruise control? EGT protection?
Also would love to know what hardware you used and software details. I can understand if you want to keep secrets for the purpose selling things though. I only ask because I have been mulling over an MW EMS for a short while.
It might also be good for the EMS to keep track of oil pressure. That way it can limit torque intelligently, as well as have an auto-shutdown if something goes bad.
(05-04-2010, 10:28 AM)DervTuning There is no transmission interface, as I will be using the Getrag 5MT from the 16 valve.
DervTuning That is a good idea about the oil pressure, thanks! It should be able to interface the oil pressure sensor signal to limit the fuel to the idle setting or shut the engine off completely.
(05-04-2010, 10:28 AM)DervTuning There is no transmission interface, as I will be using the Getrag 5MT from the 16 valve.
DervTuning That is a good idea about the oil pressure, thanks! It should be able to interface the oil pressure sensor signal to limit the fuel to the idle setting or shut the engine off completely.
Hey let's not get to electronic happy on the tranny side. Great idea in all, but personal preference would be let's keep it to the driver and let him drive. Forget the rev match, a little heel toe is just fine.
(05-06-2010, 08:11 AM)George3soccer Hey let's not get to electronic happy on the tranny side. Great idea in all, but personal preference would be let's keep it to the driver and let him drive. Forget the rev match, a little heel toe is just fine.
Thanks for all the compliments. I will add more to this response later, as I have too much to do right now
Rev matching is something I thought about, and should be fairly easily be realized.
I do plan to fit a large VGT turbine to the engine, and I do not mind making the power in the upper rpm range as well. It should keep lots of things happy, including me
(05-06-2010, 08:11 AM)George3soccer Hey let's not get to electronic happy on the tranny side. Great idea in all, but personal preference would be let's keep it to the driver and let him drive. Forget the rev match, a little heel toe is just fine.
Wow! Having just got myself a 606 to swap into my w201 here in the uk, I'm very interested in hearing more about you ems. I work in electronics, we make marine survey equipment and I know how hard reverse engineering something is. I really applaud your efforts.
I was going to blow 1200 euros on a myna pump for my engine, but if your willing to release schematics and firmware, even for a charge, I would be happy to go down the electronic route and stick with the current pump.
(05-13-2010, 02:29 PM)HughF_UK Wow! Having just got myself a 606 to swap into my w201 here in the uk, I'm very interested in hearing more about your ems. I work in electronics, we make marine survey equipment and I know how hard reverse engineering something is. I really applaud your efforts.
I was going to blow 1200 euros on a myna pump for my engine, but if your willing to release schematics and firmware, even for a charge, I would be happy to go down the electronic route and stick with the current pump.
(05-13-2010, 02:29 PM)HughF_UK Wow! Having just got myself a 606 to swap into my w201 here in the uk, I'm very interested in hearing more about your ems. I work in electronics, we make marine survey equipment and I know how hard reverse engineering something is. I really applaud your efforts.
I was going to blow 1200 euros on a myna pump for my engine, but if your willing to release schematics and firmware, even for a charge, I would be happy to go down the electronic route and stick with the current pump.
(05-17-2010, 01:44 PM)Alastair E(05-13-2010, 02:29 PM)HughF_UK Wow! Having just got myself a 606 to swap into my w201 here in the uk, I'm very interested in hearing more about your ems. I work in electronics, we make marine survey equipment and I know how hard reverse engineering something is. I really applaud your efforts.
I was going to blow 1200 euros on a myna pump for my engine, but if your willing to release schematics and firmware, even for a charge, I would be happy to go down the electronic route and stick with the current pump.
For major power increases, above the 175? std. you'll still need to replace the elements --even in your Electronic type pump....
Apparently, the OEM Exhaust-Manifold is a major bottleneck much above 200BHP from what I read, but the Finns do have a nice tubular option for that with a std. T3 or T4 flange, so with That, and a honking great Holset, and you're all set for daft power outputs.......
But-- Dont go to Myna....
Contact Tomnik on this Forum. He can mod up a std. 'M' type from a 603 with 7.5mm elements, This is the way I plan to do it, using a std. 603 type pump rather than the electronic original. I believe he has developed a Test-Plan for the upgrade for the mechanical governor pumps, so that any competant injection-shop could do the mod....Need to check with Tom...
--It is said, that Tomnik's German sourced elements are far higher quality than the ones that Myna use, They were specially made and ground for this application...
--Guess its also possible to fit the M75 7.5 Floyd elements from Tom to the electronic pump originally on your 606 too, but you'll need to check with him first....
--Nice to see another UK member doing daft things with Diesels!
I plan on fitting a 606 to a W123, I may have a line on a 606....
Your plan to shove it in a W201 may be simpler than the W123 though!
Thanks for the kind words HughF_UK and Alastiar, etc
You could do it either way depending on what you like; electronic or mechanical. If you would like to use the electronic pump, all you need is the pump, and the rpm sensor on the flywheel. If that is damaged, another type of sensor could be fitted so the EMS gets what it needs
Depending on how the development goes, I might end up contacting you about the circuit boards.
A little update, I was able to post a video of the engine running on the test stand. Higher quality videos will follow, once I have a break from the messing about with the M 5 cylinder mechanical pump!
606EMS
There I was testing the idle response, as well as adjusting the idle rpms. If the engine were in the car, I would take it for a test drive!
(05-17-2010, 01:44 PM)Alastair E(05-13-2010, 02:29 PM)HughF_UK Wow! Having just got myself a 606 to swap into my w201 here in the uk, I'm very interested in hearing more about your ems. I work in electronics, we make marine survey equipment and I know how hard reverse engineering something is. I really applaud your efforts.
I was going to blow 1200 euros on a myna pump for my engine, but if your willing to release schematics and firmware, even for a charge, I would be happy to go down the electronic route and stick with the current pump.
For major power increases, above the 175? std. you'll still need to replace the elements --even in your Electronic type pump....
Apparently, the OEM Exhaust-Manifold is a major bottleneck much above 200BHP from what I read, but the Finns do have a nice tubular option for that with a std. T3 or T4 flange, so with That, and a honking great Holset, and you're all set for daft power outputs.......
But-- Dont go to Myna....
Contact Tomnik on this Forum. He can mod up a std. 'M' type from a 603 with 7.5mm elements, This is the way I plan to do it, using a std. 603 type pump rather than the electronic original. I believe he has developed a Test-Plan for the upgrade for the mechanical governor pumps, so that any competant injection-shop could do the mod....Need to check with Tom...
--It is said, that Tomnik's German sourced elements are far higher quality than the ones that Myna use, They were specially made and ground for this application...
--Guess its also possible to fit the M75 7.5 Floyd elements from Tom to the electronic pump originally on your 606 too, but you'll need to check with him first....
--Nice to see another UK member doing daft things with Diesels!
I plan on fitting a 606 to a W123, I may have a line on a 606....
Your plan to shove it in a W201 may be simpler than the W123 though!
(05-24-2010, 11:03 AM)DervTuning If that is damaged, another type of sensor could be fitted so the EMS gets what it needs
(05-24-2010, 11:03 AM)DervTuning If that is damaged, another type of sensor could be fitted so the EMS gets what it needs
I'm a newbie here, but I'll chime in that if the schematics or finished EMS are available for reasonable price, I'm in. I'm replacing an OM603 in a S350 (D) with an OM606 - was going the mechanical pump route from my existing engine till I saw this forum.
You can fit the mechanical pump very easy in your SDL, and still use your standard cruise control, i use this setup in mine, and it works fine.
You will have to make a spacer ( about 20mm ) for the oilfilter so it will clear the inlet manifold and use the oilfilter from the 603, then it is a straight bolton
DervTuning....
Out of curiosity, which cylinder did your faulty injector come out of?
I bought a near complete W210 with running engine, that when started from stone-cold has that typical iffy injector diesel-knock for about 15 secs, on 1 pot.
After that its dead smooth and quiet. I had forgotten how nice a 6 pot sounds in comparison to a 5 pot 617!
Removed engine and trans complete today, will separate and bring home tomorrow with any luck...
(05-13-2010, 02:29 PM)HughF_UK Wow! Having just got myself a 606 to swap into my w201 here in the uk, I'm very interested in hearing more about you ems. I work in electronics, we make marine survey equipment and I know how hard reverse engineering something is. I really applaud your efforts.
I was going to blow 1200 euros on a myna pump for my engine, but if your willing to release schematics and firmware, even for a charge, I would be happy to go down the electronic route and stick with the current pump.
(05-13-2010, 02:29 PM)HughF_UK Wow! Having just got myself a 606 to swap into my w201 here in the uk, I'm very interested in hearing more about you ems. I work in electronics, we make marine survey equipment and I know how hard reverse engineering something is. I really applaud your efforts.
I was going to blow 1200 euros on a myna pump for my engine, but if your willing to release schematics and firmware, even for a charge, I would be happy to go down the electronic route and stick with the current pump.
Yea and if we all lived in Finland and had millions of dollars that might work! But over here in the U.S derv is the man!
I shot this video today of the waveform of the rack control PCM signal.
The wave length is 24.5 ms @ about 13 volts which translates to 40.8 hz.
Here is a much easier way to run the electronic IP on the 606. No electronics needed, but the method has a few drawbacks http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0hgSaenbSo
Hi I am looking to put 2 606 engines in my boat can you tell me if you have finished making your EMS for the pump on these engines.
If so will you be able to sell me 2 of these units and at what price.
Thanks Regards Kevin Smith
Not likely,
The OP flaked out a couple of years ago and didnt respond to calls/email/etc from any of the people who sent him stuff. I was finally able to get my IP back months later from the guy who was doing the actual tuning and sent it to another shop to get Tomniks elements installed. As for any of this electronic stuff, it likely disappeared with the OP...
http://dmn.kuulalaakeri.org/dmn-edc/ is the only project that I can find like this that seems to be still going although it doesnt seem to be happening with much pace. There are dozens of projects like this on the net but they all seem to end after getting the idle up and running for whatever reason.
(04-21-2013, 06:56 PM)Mark_M http://dmn.kuulalaakeri.org/dmn-edc/ is the only project that I can find like this that seems to be still going although it doesnt seem to be happening with much pace. There are dozens of projects like this on the net but they all seem to end after getting the idle up and running for whatever reason.
(04-21-2013, 06:56 PM)Mark_M http://dmn.kuulalaakeri.org/dmn-edc/ is the only project that I can find like this that seems to be still going although it doesnt seem to be happening with much pace. There are dozens of projects like this on the net but they all seem to end after getting the idle up and running for whatever reason.
It would probably be of greater benefit to the European contingent who have an almost endless supply of .962 engines available because of the rust issues without having to source the mech pumps which are not in as great a supply here. Once there was an EMS available it could presumably be 'tuned' to whatever parameters the owner required.
And I dont suppose it would be any more difficult for Meken to fit 7.5 elements to an electronic pump than to a mechanical one.
This is a fairly simple thing to do. I was working on drive by wire with the PCS datalogger using the boost control feature. I could target a position based on throttle position with redundant tps signals. I see no problem running the diesel pump with this. It would be easier since you do not have to worry about return spring pressure etc. Not as twitchy. You could also use the rack position as feed back if you want. The most important thing is to have fail safes. I was also thinking of having it target a pwm with tps value and then have the other pwm output be a failsafe for rack position. Idle speed control would not be attainable though. You would just have to set a targeted pwm a little high.
While this thread has me thinking of how I can put an OM606 pump and sensors on my 603, I'm still thinking about converting a mechanical pump to DBW.
The throttle bodies in Ford products use DC motors with gear reduction and return spring force, not steppers. There are redundant TP sensors that you can log for both the pedal and the body. The sensors are biased opposite (one 5v closed and 0v WOT, the other sensor is vice versa) so that a possible short between the signal wires can't override failsafe. On inspection, I suspect that this is just an encoder which is a good idea. They can be made tiny and reliable. The reason I'm talking about Ford crap is because it's good to know how the O.E.'s are doing it so you might be able to identify a safety risk when you deviate from their setups. The DC motor with gear reduction and dual return springs is too elaborate and large but probably safest. A stepper seems to be ticket.
One of the failsafe modes could include applying vacuum to the shutoff valve just in case you can't return the stepper to the idle position.