5 speed manual om617
5 speed manual om617
i am new to to posting on this board please let me know if im doing something wrong
i would like to share my story of putting a 5 speed manual in my 300sd
the trans is a 717.411
i did the job with a drill and a grinder.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5FzQwXbnmQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5YX-WWINf0
Do you have any details on what you did to mate the bellhousing to the engine?
What did you use for a flywheel?
(01-21-2013, 12:03 PM)willbhere4u What did you use for a flywheel?
(01-21-2013, 12:03 PM)willbhere4u What did you use for a flywheel?
Then this trans came from a car with a dual mass flywheel, correct?
(01-21-2013, 02:30 PM)raysorenson Then this trans came from a car with a dual mass flywheel, correct?
Hey there
1st step
Is to clamp the stock Mercedes adapter to the trans as you will notice nothing lines up except the alignment pins.
2nd step
Is to drill through the adapter and through the transmission
3rd step
It to take a grinder and create clearance for the new bolts heads, i went and bought alien headed bolts that thread into the engine block.
4th step
You will need to cut the material out so that the starter fits in all the way.
i will post some pictures
Adapter? Can one just use a 1/4" plate or something? I'm a little confused here, maybe after pictures come it will clear things up
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
Mercedes used a 1" thick piece of alum to go between the block and tranny. use that
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
Here is a picture of a w123 pedal set L next to a w126 set R
(01-23-2013, 05:00 PM)willbhere4u Here is a picture of a w123 pedal set L next to a w126 set R
Fred, (at least I assume that's you!)
Thanks for posting all of this up... I'm glad you took a bunch of pics when you made this happen. I will likely delve into this sometime after I finish up school (last quarter!). This has a 0.77:1 fifth gear, yeah? that sure would be nice!
Anyway, not sure if you saw my reply on the 'Tube, but I def. would like to check this out in person sometime.
Josh
just to clarify a couple of things: the 2nd pic above appears to have a plate sandwiched between the adapter and trans case... looks like maybe 1/4" aluminium...is that the reason for the input shaft not quite reaching the pilot bearing?
also, did you end up getting a bolt in the top hole (just above top starter bolt) or did you leave that out? Edit: NVM, I see in the youtube vid that there is a bolt there...
This is actually quite an elegant solution overall...nice work!
(01-24-2013, 12:31 PM)SurfRodder Fred, (at least I assume that's you!)
Thanks for posting all of this up... I'm glad you took a bunch of pics when you made this happen. I will likely delve into this sometime after I finish up school (last quarter!). This has a 0.77:1 fifth gear, yeah? that sure would be nice!
Anyway, not sure if you saw my reply on the 'Tube, but I def. would like to check this out in person sometime.
Josh
(01-24-2013, 12:31 PM)SurfRodder Fred, (at least I assume that's you!)
Thanks for posting all of this up... I'm glad you took a bunch of pics when you made this happen. I will likely delve into this sometime after I finish up school (last quarter!). This has a 0.77:1 fifth gear, yeah? that sure would be nice!
Anyway, not sure if you saw my reply on the 'Tube, but I def. would like to check this out in person sometime.
Josh
(01-24-2013, 12:39 PM)5spd617 Yes it is a .77 fifth. And a 2.88 rearend so I would call it bonneville gears. 5 is only good for over 68 mph. And at about 80 I'm doing 2600 rpm. And last trip I did from Colorado to Northern California I was getting 30+ mpg.
(01-24-2013, 12:39 PM)5spd617 Yes it is a .77 fifth. And a 2.88 rearend so I would call it bonneville gears. 5 is only good for over 68 mph. And at about 80 I'm doing 2600 rpm. And last trip I did from Colorado to Northern California I was getting 30+ mpg.
My euro 5spd 300td non turbo wagon has 2.88 gears and dose fine! Evan with out a turbo. It will cruise 80mph all day long
Neat idea, thinking outside the box for sure.
Looks like 2 "V" cutouts on the side of the case for the new drilled bolts. Did you have a piece of metal welded to the inside to keep out dirt, water etc....?
I have 240D 4-spd installed in the 85 300D. seems like there needs to be a gear between 2 and 3, and 3 and 4th.
I have a 5-spd from a 16V 2.3 190E with the Dogleg trans. I thought it would be a good candidate. yeah I know 5th is 1:1.
Charlie
What really catches my attention is that, not only do the dowels line up, but when they do the input shaft is centered. Talk about an easy button.
(01-28-2013, 08:33 AM)lpumb3 AWESOME PROJECT . IM INTO sry caps, im into a manual 126 sawp . im curious for more info on how you modifiyed the 126 pedal set . i have the 123 set from the swap car . another member pointed out yours before i tried to purchase a 126 set.
(01-28-2013, 08:33 AM)lpumb3 AWESOME PROJECT . IM INTO sry caps, im into a manual 126 sawp . im curious for more info on how you modifiyed the 126 pedal set . i have the 123 set from the swap car . another member pointed out yours before i tried to purchase a 126 set.
(01-24-2013, 10:39 PM)raysorenson What really catches my attention is that, not only do the dowels line up, but when they do the input shaft is centered. Talk about an easy button.
(01-24-2013, 10:39 PM)raysorenson What really catches my attention is that, not only do the dowels line up, but when they do the input shaft is centered. Talk about an easy button.
Ugh, since I haven't done my 4-speed swap yet I'm seriously considering doing this....
(03-18-2013, 10:00 PM)sassparilla_kid Ugh, since I haven't done my 4-speed swap yet I'm seriously considering doing this....
(03-18-2013, 10:00 PM)sassparilla_kid Ugh, since I haven't done my 4-speed swap yet I'm seriously considering doing this....
(08-27-2013, 03:28 PM)5spd617 it is really nice to have the overdrive with the 2.88 rear end. haha. 80 mph at ~2500 rpm
really good mileage on the freeway about 30 mpg.
after getting a good flex joint and good bolts i haven't had any issues.
(08-27-2013, 03:28 PM)5spd617 it is really nice to have the overdrive with the 2.88 rear end. haha. 80 mph at ~2500 rpm
really good mileage on the freeway about 30 mpg.
after getting a good flex joint and good bolts i haven't had any issues.
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
Good to see oyu on STD Luna
When I had my crapcan I got 28mpg ONCE doing 55-60 the whole way (was afraid an axle would fail). That was with an auto and mediocre engine tuning.
larsalan I guess I need to look at this stupid ass drip shit. What you have to like mess with those elements on the pump? What a fucking hassle. then use some wire to hold the throttle open or some shit?
(11-01-2013, 12:03 PM)Simpler=Better Good to see oyu on STD Luna
When I had my crapcan I got 28mpg ONCE doing 55-60 the whole way (was afraid an axle would fail). That was with an auto and mediocre engine tuning.
(11-01-2013, 12:03 PM)Simpler=Better Good to see oyu on STD Luna
When I had my crapcan I got 28mpg ONCE doing 55-60 the whole way (was afraid an axle would fail). That was with an auto and mediocre engine tuning.
I get ~26.5 driving faster than I need to, mixed driving. Highway I've gotten 29.5 going 70-75, with the 4-speed swap, so I'd reckon 32-33 maybe with a 5-speed
(03-12-2013, 12:11 AM)kmaser Is it possible that G wagen flywheel and clutch would work with this combo, heavier flywheel stringer clutch?
(03-13-2013, 01:30 PM)kmaser One more question, does the 717.411 bolt to an OM606? if that's the case you could do the same to get a 722.6 onto a 617?
(03-12-2013, 12:11 AM)kmaser Is it possible that G wagen flywheel and clutch would work with this combo, heavier flywheel stringer clutch?
(03-13-2013, 01:30 PM)kmaser One more question, does the 717.411 bolt to an OM606? if that's the case you could do the same to get a 722.6 onto a 617?
(11-01-2013, 11:24 AM)Jooseppi Luna(08-27-2013, 03:28 PM)5spd617 it is really nice to have the overdrive with the 2.88 rear end. haha. 80 mph at ~2500 rpm
really good mileage on the freeway about 30 mpg.
after getting a good flex joint and good bolts i haven't had any issues.
What speed do you get 30 MPG at? 80 MPH? 30 MPG @ 80 MPH in a luxury barge would be awesome and makes me wonder what kind of mileage I could achieve at lower speeds... 35 MPG? That would be awesome. I remember that Doktor Bert on PeachParts said that he could hit 35-37 MPG doing 60 MPH in his W116 'SD with automatic after he swapped in a 2.47:1 differential.
A few questions on the swap:
1) Is the 5-speed shorter than the auto or is it the other way around? What is the difference in length? Did you end up needing to modify the driveshaft?
2) What did you use for a shifter? The W201 shifter?
3) What did you do about the shifter linkages?
4) Did you ever end up covering the starter hole with anything?
(11-01-2013, 11:24 AM)Jooseppi Luna(08-27-2013, 03:28 PM)5spd617 it is really nice to have the overdrive with the 2.88 rear end. haha. 80 mph at ~2500 rpm
really good mileage on the freeway about 30 mpg.
after getting a good flex joint and good bolts i haven't had any issues.
What speed do you get 30 MPG at? 80 MPH? 30 MPG @ 80 MPH in a luxury barge would be awesome and makes me wonder what kind of mileage I could achieve at lower speeds... 35 MPG? That would be awesome. I remember that Doktor Bert on PeachParts said that he could hit 35-37 MPG doing 60 MPH in his W116 'SD with automatic after he swapped in a 2.47:1 differential.
A few questions on the swap:
1) Is the 5-speed shorter than the auto or is it the other way around? What is the difference in length? Did you end up needing to modify the driveshaft?
2) What did you use for a shifter? The W201 shifter?
3) What did you do about the shifter linkages?
4) Did you ever end up covering the starter hole with anything?
Does the 717.411 have an electric or mechanical speedo setup?
Crossing my fingers for electric.
5spd617 -- thanks! That's extremely helpful.
sassaparilla & Mike -- it's mechanical, but [URL=http://www.jegs.com/p/VDO/VDO-GPS-Speed-Sender/2876446/10002/-1][here] is a cool $180 solution for the electric speedo cars.
Or one could just get an instrument cluster from any 1982+ diesel W123. Right? Isn't it only the '81 300TD that uses an electric speedo?
sassaparilla & Mike -- it's mechanical, but [URL=http://www.jegs.com/p/VDO/VDO-GPS-Speed-Sender/2876446/10002/-1][here] is a cool $180 solution for the electric speedo cars.
[/quote]
Yeah that's the only w123 with an electric speedo, the rest are all mechanical
My gosh I would love to have that setup someday. I feel the 5speed with my 3.07 rears would be the ticket. I thought about switching to a 2.88 diff, but I've always wanted a manual.
Wish I had enough open space long enough in my shop to do this.
So you used a 240D flywheel with a 717.411 5 speed, a double roller bearing to accommodate the shorter shaft, lengthen the shifting rods, and w201 drive shafts?
(01-28-2014, 09:41 PM)MFSuper90 My gosh I would love to have that setup someday. I feel the 5speed with my 3.07 rears would be the ticket. I thought about switching to a 2.88 diff, but I've always wanted a manual.
(01-28-2014, 09:41 PM)MFSuper90 My gosh I would love to have that setup someday. I feel the 5speed with my 3.07 rears would be the ticket. I thought about switching to a 2.88 diff, but I've always wanted a manual.
If I ever find a decently priced 717.411 petals and stuff, this WILL get done to my w123. I can't sot thinking how awesome it'd be
(02-03-2014, 09:26 AM)MFSuper90 If I ever find a decently priced 717.411 petals and stuff, this WILL get done to my w123. I can't sot thinking how awesome it'd be
(02-03-2014, 09:26 AM)MFSuper90 If I ever find a decently priced 717.411 petals and stuff, this WILL get done to my w123. I can't sot thinking how awesome it'd be
(02-03-2014, 12:46 PM)MFSuper90 What flywheel? 240D then that double roller bearing?
(01-28-2014, 09:41 PM)MFSuper90 My gosh I would love to have that setup someday. I feel the 5speed with my 3.07 rears would be the ticket. I thought about switching to a 2.88 diff, but I've always wanted a manual.
Wish I had enough open space long enough in my shop to do this.
So you used a 240D flywheel with a 717.411 5 speed, a double roller bearing to accommodate the shorter shaft, lengthen the shifting rods, and w201 drive shafts?
(02-03-2014, 12:46 PM)MFSuper90 What flywheel? 240D then that double roller bearing?
(01-28-2014, 09:41 PM)MFSuper90 My gosh I would love to have that setup someday. I feel the 5speed with my 3.07 rears would be the ticket. I thought about switching to a 2.88 diff, but I've always wanted a manual.
Wish I had enough open space long enough in my shop to do this.
So you used a 240D flywheel with a 717.411 5 speed, a double roller bearing to accommodate the shorter shaft, lengthen the shifting rods, and w201 drive shafts?
Correct me if I'm wrong here, but is it accurate that you had to use the double roller bearing because of your additional adapter plate? Couldn't you instead grind the thickness of the additional adapter plate off of the adapter plate that came with the engine to make that part simpler?
There was no additional adapter plate, he just drilled a new set of holes in the existing mounting plate
(03-27-2014, 09:29 PM)Jooseppi Luna Correct me if I'm wrong here, but is it accurate that you had to use the double roller bearing because of your additional adapter plate? Couldn't you instead grind the thickness of the additional adapter plate off of the adapter plate that came with the engine to make that part simpler?
Chelmsford, huh? do you know Joe clark or Tommy Caruso?
(03-27-2014, 09:29 PM)Jooseppi Luna Correct me if I'm wrong here, but is it accurate that you had to use the double roller bearing because of your additional adapter plate? Couldn't you instead grind the thickness of the additional adapter plate off of the adapter plate that came with the engine to make that part simpler?
Fred do you have a part number for the double roller bearing?
Measurement for the drive shaft shortening and shift linkage?
update of the car still running like a champ jut installed a new clutch and the double roller bearing dident really work so i machined a spacer ring to fit the flywheel and hold the stock 240d pilot bearing
im putting the car up for sale its a 1985 300sd great car tow-hitch everything workes has a little damage on passenger doors