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Om 606 prechamber Fail
zeeman Offline
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#1
Om 606 prechamber Fail
First run of a used engine in my latest conversion. Engine was noisy, sounded like a piston knock. Then it started missing.
Ran a compression check, number 5 had hardly any compression. Pulled head off and this is what I found, the prechamber had failed. Anyone have an idea what caused this?


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11-27-2018, 03:09 AM
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NZScott Offline
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#2
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
I believe faulty nozzles do things like that...was a debate about that though somewhere

(by faulty I mean poor spray pattern/leaks below pop pressure)

1978 300D, 373,000km
OM617.912 with a Holset HX30W, 7.5mm IP, 711.113 5 speed (awaiting certification to be legal...)

1977 250 270,000km (parts car)
1977 300D (ex 280) 500,000km 'new' DD





11-28-2018, 01:31 AM
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Hercules Offline
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#3
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
Mercedes Benz  Says, caused by a drippy injector.
11-29-2018, 03:49 AM
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jav1 Offline
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#4
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
I'm no expert but #4 seems wetter than 6 or 3 as well?
11-29-2018, 08:03 AM
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atypicalguy Offline
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#5
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(11-27-2018, 03:09 AM)zeeman Wrote: First run of a used engine in my latest conversion. Engine was noisy, sounded like a piston knock. Then it started missing.
Ran a compression check, number 5 had hardly any compression. Pulled head off and this is what I found, the prechamber had failed. Anyone have an idea what caused this?

yes it is liquid fuel dripping onto the prechamber when the prechamber is glowing. Those prechamber tips get extremely hot and they cannot handle the rapid cooling. So if the injector starts to leak, the tip eventually falls off the prechamber and dances around inside the cylinder, which doesn't have any room for that sort of thing.
11-29-2018, 09:40 AM
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zeeman Offline
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#6
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(11-29-2018, 08:03 AM)jav1 Wrote: I'm no expert but #4 seems wetter than 6 or 3 as well?

#4 also had some wall scoring from debris. It looks like a set of new pistons an boring. Yeah.
11-29-2018, 03:43 PM
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jav1 Offline
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#7
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
Ouch! Sorry man- that's a lot of extra work. Kanda makes me want to replace my nozzles now... just in case.
11-29-2018, 04:08 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#8
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(11-29-2018, 04:08 PM)jav1 Wrote: Ouch!  Sorry man- that's a lot of extra work. Kanda makes me want to replace my nozzles now... just in case.

I always have the injectors rebuilt and the IP. pump recalibrated when I have the elements put in. This is for a customers conversion and I don't want any problems. But this happened before I purchased the used engine, and you don't know what the history is. May be a good idea to change the pre-chambers also.
11-29-2018, 05:37 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#9
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(11-29-2018, 09:40 AM)atypicalguy Wrote:
(11-27-2018, 03:09 AM)zeeman Wrote: First run of a used engine in my latest conversion. Engine was noisy, sounded like a piston knock. Then it started missing.
Ran a compression check, number 5 had hardly any compression. Pulled head off and this is what I found, the prechamber had failed. Anyone have an idea what caused this?

yes it is liquid fuel dripping onto the prechamber when the prechamber is glowing. Those prechamber tips get extremely hot and they cannot handle the rapid cooling. So if the injector starts to leak, the tip eventually falls off the prechamber and dances around inside the cylinder, which doesn't have any room for that sort of thing.

Just talked to Luke at DieselpumpUK and he agrees to the fuel dripping. Also said if the timing is too advanced will cause the problem also. Agreed that pulling pre-chambers out and inspecting for cracks was a wise idea.
11-29-2018, 05:58 PM
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atypicalguy Offline
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#10
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
Hard to build a business on motors of unclear provenance. Unless it was my car, I would pull the head and measure and inspect everything before installing. Pay me now, pay me later. People can handle expected expenses better than unexpected ones.
12-08-2018, 08:21 AM
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maneyc91 Offline
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#11
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
Well i had a little laugh to myself when i saw this thread, I came here to make a thread about my prechamber failure and found this instead, with pictures that could have been from my motor it looks so similar, cylinder #5 for me too. I was driving along and it just went downhill real fast, smoking, sputtering etc. No comp on cyl number 5, smoking out the intake ports. From what i could see its an injector problem. The bummer is mine happened about 2 weeks after i finished doing a mech pump swap, big turbo etc. My plan of approach is to pull motor, swap in a good piston and rod, get the valves for #5 worked on, smooth out the damage on the head, put 'er back together. Luckily my holset hx35 didint get damaged by the metal chunks. Probably going to pull my motor later today.....
12-10-2018, 12:57 PM
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maneyc91 Offline
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#12
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
Well i had a little laugh to myself when i saw this thread, I came here to make a thread about my prechamber failure and found this instead, with pictures that could have been from my motor they look so similar, cylinder #5 for me too. I was driving along and it just went downhill real fast, smoking, sputtering etc. No comp on cyl number 5, smoking out the intake ports. From what i could see its an injector problem. The bummer is mine happened about 2 weeks after i finished doing a mech pump swap, big turbo etc. My plan of approach is to pull motor, swap in a good piston and rod, get the valves for #5 worked on, smooth out the damage on the head, put 'er back together. Luckily my holset hx35 didnt get damaged by the metal chunks. Probably going to pull my motor later today.....

editt:: my damage is actually isolated to just the #5 so i guess i got lucky there, my motor still has all its crosshatching after 200k
(This post was last modified: 12-10-2018, 01:00 PM by maneyc91.)
12-10-2018, 12:58 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#13
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-08-2018, 08:21 AM)atypicalguy Wrote: Hard to build a business on motors of unclear provenance. Unless it was my car, I would pull the head and measure and inspect everything before installing. Pay me now, pay me later. People can handle expected expenses better than unexpected ones.
The object was to buy low mile used engines, (under 150,000) so not have to rebuild them at and added cost. The usual checks, compression test, rebuild injectors, rebuild I.P pump and checking the bottom bearings while the pan is off should be sufficient.

This is another issue that needs to be addressed. The prechambers should be removed and checked and replaced if necessary. For the most part rebuilding a low mile engine is a waste of time and money. These engines hold up well normally and do not require them to be rebuilt unless they have excess miles.
12-12-2018, 01:02 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#14
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-10-2018, 12:58 PM)maneyc91 Wrote: Well i had a little laugh to myself when i saw this thread, I came here to make a thread about my prechamber failure and found this instead, with pictures that could have been from my motor they look so similar, cylinder #5 for me too. I was driving along and it just went downhill real fast, smoking, sputtering etc. No comp on cyl number 5, smoking out the intake ports. From what i could see its an injector problem. The bummer is mine happened about 2 weeks after i finished doing a mech pump swap, big turbo etc. My plan of approach is to pull motor, swap in a good piston and rod, get the valves for #5 worked on, smooth out the damage on the head, put 'er back together. Luckily my holset hx35 didnt get damaged by the metal chunks. Probably going to pull my motor later today.....

editt:: my damage is actually isolated to just the #5 so i guess i got lucky there, my motor still has all its crosshatching after 200k
The number 5 cylinder seems to be the problem cylinder. You might also want to do the Diesel Meken thermostat bypass to number 5 cylinder as well. He has a you-tube video on this, I do this to all my conversion engines. DieselpumpUK also just came out with a smaller water pump pulley to run the water pump faster to improve cooling.
12-12-2018, 01:08 PM
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jav1 Offline
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#15
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
did you find a source for prechambers?
12-12-2018, 01:25 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#16
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-12-2018, 01:25 PM)jav1 Wrote: did you find a source for prechambers?

I have not. Other then Mercedes and I haven't talked to them yet if they are available.
12-13-2018, 03:22 AM
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atypicalguy Offline
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#17
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-12-2018, 01:08 PM)zeeman Wrote:
(12-10-2018, 12:58 PM)maneyc91 Wrote: Well i had a little laugh to myself when i saw this thread, I came here to make a thread about my prechamber failure and found this instead, with pictures that could have been from my motor they look so similar, cylinder #5 for me too. I was driving along and it just went downhill real fast, smoking, sputtering etc. No comp on cyl number 5, smoking out the intake ports. From what i could see its an injector problem. The bummer is mine happened about 2 weeks after i finished doing a mech pump swap, big turbo etc. My plan of approach is to pull motor, swap in a good piston and rod, get the valves for #5 worked on, smooth out the damage on the head, put 'er back together. Luckily my holset hx35 didnt get damaged by the metal chunks. Probably going to pull my motor later today.....

editt:: my damage is actually isolated to just the #5 so i guess i got lucky there, my motor still has all its crosshatching after 200k
The number 5 cylinder seems to be the problem cylinder. You might also want to do the Diesel Meken thermostat bypass to number 5 cylinder as well. He has a you-tube video on this, I do this to all my conversion engines. DieselpumpUK also just came out with a smaller water pump pulley to run the water pump faster to improve cooling.

If it is an injector issue then why would coolant flow affect anything? Doesnt make sense. Unless injectors fail from poor coolant flow.
12-15-2018, 12:52 AM
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zeeman Offline
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#18
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-15-2018, 12:52 AM)atypicalguy Wrote:
(12-12-2018, 01:08 PM)zeeman Wrote:
(12-10-2018, 12:58 PM)maneyc91 Wrote: Well i had a little laugh to myself when i saw this thread, I came here to make a thread about my prechamber failure and found this instead, with pictures that could have been from my motor they look so similar, cylinder #5 for me too. I was driving along and it just went downhill real fast, smoking, sputtering etc. No comp on cyl number 5, smoking out the intake ports. From what i could see its an injector problem. The bummer is mine happened about 2 weeks after i finished doing a mech pump swap, big turbo etc. My plan of approach is to pull motor, swap in a good piston and rod, get the valves for #5 worked on, smooth out the damage on the head, put 'er back together. Luckily my holset hx35 didnt get damaged by the metal chunks. Probably going to pull my motor later today.....

editt:: my damage is actually isolated to just the #5 so i guess i got lucky there, my motor still has all its crosshatching after 200k
The number 5 cylinder seems to be the problem cylinder. You might also want to do the Diesel Meken thermostat bypass to number 5 cylinder as well. He has a you-tube video on this, I do this to all my conversion engines. DieselpumpUK also just came out with a smaller water pump pulley to run the water pump faster to improve cooling.

If it is an injector issue then why would coolant flow affect anything? Doesnt make sense. Unless injectors fail from poor coolant flow.

Coolant also cools the cylinder temperature. That is why when EGT goes up so does water temperature.  Number 5 cylinder seems to be the worst one hence the water bypass. The hotter the cylinder temperature the hotter the prechamber is. Although the prechamber is failing from an injector dripping on it after the engine is shut off, water temperature plays a part in this. The water bypass eliminates a hot spot.
12-15-2018, 05:06 PM
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maneyc91 Offline
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#19
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
Well my motor and tranny are sitting on the floor next to the car, im waiting on a new piston and rod, just going to swap it in and hope for the best. Gotta have some valve work done too obviously. If I cant get a prechamber after going through all this I dont even know what i ll do. If i see an unsuspecting e300 in the wild they will not be safe.      I assume that anything that was assembled by MB and working properly should be left alone as far as inside the motor? Im a pretty good wrench btw, my e36 has a 347 stroker, 76mm turbo,DIYmegasquirt and 8.8 IRS rear end all done by me.

Ill look into that coolant bypass....
(This post was last modified: 12-15-2018, 09:59 PM by maneyc91.)
12-15-2018, 09:58 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#20
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-15-2018, 09:58 PM)maneyc91 Wrote: Well my motor and tranny are sitting on the floor next to the car, im waiting on a new piston and rod, just going to swap it in and hope for the best. Gotta have some valve work done too obviously. If I cant get a prechamber after going through all this I dont even know what i ll do. If i see an unsuspecting e300 in the wild they will not be safe.      I assume that anything that was assembled by MB and working properly should be left alone as far as inside the motor? Im a pretty good wrench btw, my e36 has a 347 stroker, 76mm turbo,DIYmegasquirt and 8.8 IRS rear end all done by me.

Ill look into that coolant bypass....

You might weigh the rod and piston separately on a gram scale and make sure they are close to your old one. Or have a engine balancer check it for you. As for the inside of the motor, one never knows who has been into it. I have found though that the bottom ends are usually in great shape. Tell tale is silicon sealer on the gasket surfaces telling that someone has been inside.


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12-16-2018, 09:07 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#21
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-15-2018, 09:58 PM)maneyc91 Wrote: Well my motor and tranny are sitting on the floor next to the car, im waiting on a new piston and rod, just going to swap it in and hope for the best. Gotta have some valve work done too obviously. If I cant get a prechamber after going through all this I dont even know what i ll do. If i see an unsuspecting e300 in the wild they will not be safe.      I assume that anything that was assembled by MB and working properly should be left alone as far as inside the motor? Im a pretty good wrench btw, my e36 has a 347 stroker, 76mm turbo,DIYmegasquirt and 8.8 IRS rear end all done by me.

Ill look into that coolant bypass....

Pre chamber part # 606 010 04 52       $185.00

Zeeman
12-16-2018, 10:05 PM
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maneyc91 Offline
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#22
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
Hows your repair going? ive been slacking a little this week, got my exhaust manifold off the head, and cleaned up the face of my head on the bad cylinder, been looking around for parts, just got my piston in yesterday. Still bummed about the whole ordeal but whatever, life sucks get a helmet. Im really tempted to (mercedes drop in) v8 swap this w210 while the motors out and toss this om606 in my real favorite, an e36.

also quick question, can the ball pein in the prechamber fit through the top of the prechamber? When i did not know how they worked and first pulled my injectors I vac'd out the holes and inside the hole because 200k worth of crap fell in, a little bb was stuck on the end of my vac and i went huh weird and cast it aside. It was probably from #5 which broke off but i paid such little attention to it at the time. Not sure how to look inside the others to see if the balls there. If blown out with compressed air do i need to worry about knocking a ball out?
(This post was last modified: 12-21-2018, 10:59 PM by maneyc91.)
12-21-2018, 10:53 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#23
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-21-2018, 10:53 PM)maneyc91 Wrote: Hows your repair going? ive been slacking a little this week, got my exhaust manifold off the head, and cleaned up the face of my head on the bad cylinder, been looking around for parts, just got my piston in yesterday. Still bummed about the whole ordeal but whatever, life sucks get a helmet. Im really tempted to (mercedes drop in) v8 swap this w210 while the motors out and toss this om606 in my real favorite, an e36.

also quick question, can the ball pein in the prechamber fit through the top of the prechamber? When i did not know how they worked and first pulled my injectors I vac'd out the holes and inside the hole because 200k worth of crap fell in, a little bb was stuck on the end of my vac and i went huh weird and cast it aside. It was probably from #5 which broke off but i paid such little attention to it at the time. Not sure how to look inside the others to see if the balls there. If blown out with compressed air do i need to worry about knocking a ball out?

Just got a set of NPR pistons from Germany, and took the block over to the machinest yesterday. I had to make a tool to get the piston cooling nozzles out so it could be bored.
Make sure you check the bore taper, even though there is still crosshatch in the bore the wear is at the top of the cylinder.
The ball on the tube in the prechamber can break off to and fit through the prechamber. Another failure of the prechamber. Make sure you check inside of all the prechambers.
12-23-2018, 11:41 AM
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maneyc91 Offline
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#24
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(12-23-2018, 11:41 AM)zeeman Wrote:
(12-21-2018, 10:53 PM)maneyc91 Wrote: Hows your repair going? ive been slacking a little this week, got my exhaust manifold off the head, and cleaned up the face of my head on the bad cylinder, been looking around for parts, just got my piston in yesterday. Still bummed about the whole ordeal but whatever, life sucks get a helmet. Im really tempted to (mercedes drop in) v8 swap this w210 while the motors out and toss this om606 in my real favorite, an e36.

also quick question, can the ball pein in the prechamber fit through the top of the prechamber? When i did not know how they worked and first pulled my injectors I vac'd out the holes and inside the hole because 200k worth of crap fell in, a little bb was stuck on the end of my vac and i went huh weird and cast it aside. It was probably from #5 which broke off but i paid such little attention to it at the time. Not sure how to look inside the others to see if the balls there. If blown out with compressed air do i need to worry about knocking a ball out?

Just got a set of NPR pistons from Germany, and took the block over to the machinest yesterday. I had to make a tool to get the piston cooling nozzles out so it could be bored.
Make sure you check the bore taper, even though there is still crosshatch in the bore the wear is at the top of the cylinder.
The ball on the tube in the prechamber can break off to and fit through the prechamber. Another failure of the prechamber. Make sure you check inside of all the prechambers.


Where did you get your prechamber? i ve been getting a refund and email saying they dont make them anymore from everywhere i ve tried.
02-10-2019, 08:29 PM
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zeeman Offline
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#25
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(02-10-2019, 08:29 PM)maneyc91 Wrote:
(12-23-2018, 11:41 AM)zeeman Wrote:
(12-21-2018, 10:53 PM)maneyc91 Wrote: Hows your repair going? ive been slacking a little this week, got my exhaust manifold off the head, and cleaned up the face of my head on the bad cylinder, been looking around for parts, just got my piston in yesterday. Still bummed about the whole ordeal but whatever, life sucks get a helmet. Im really tempted to (mercedes drop in) v8 swap this w210 while the motors out and toss this om606 in my real favorite, an e36.

also quick question, can the ball pein in the prechamber fit through the top of the prechamber? When i did not know how they worked and first pulled my injectors I vac'd out the holes and inside the hole because 200k worth of crap fell in, a little bb was stuck on the end of my vac and i went huh weird and cast it aside. It was probably from #5 which broke off but i paid such little attention to it at the time. Not sure how to look inside the others to see if the balls there. If blown out with compressed air do i need to worry about knocking a ball out?

Just got a set of NPR pistons from Germany, and took the block over to the machinest yesterday. I had to make a tool to get the piston cooling nozzles out so it could be bored.
Make sure you check the bore taper, even though there is still crosshatch in the bore the wear is at the top of the cylinder.
The ball on the tube in the prechamber can break off to and fit through the prechamber. Another failure of the prechamber. Make sure you check inside of all the prechambers.


Where did you get your prechamber? i ve been getting a refund and email saying they dont make them anymore from everywhere i ve tried.

You might try E-Bay UK for some used ones. I managed to get one from the extra head I had. All the rest of the pre-chambers were okay upon inspection.
02-15-2019, 02:49 PM
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maneyc91 Offline
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#26
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(02-15-2019, 02:49 PM)zeeman Wrote: You might try E-Bay UK for some used ones. I managed to get one from the extra head I had. All the rest of the pre-chambers were okay upon inspection.

If i fixed all the stuff just to not be able to get a prechamber i might just lose it.
02-16-2019, 01:35 PM
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Mallinman Offline
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#27
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
Are the 601 pre-chambers the same???
If they are then there’s one here
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=...3359859289
L200 manual om605  7.5mm 
02-17-2019, 03:48 AM
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zeeman Offline
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#28
RE: Om 606 prechamber Fail
(02-16-2019, 01:35 PM)maneyc91 Wrote:
(02-15-2019, 02:49 PM)zeeman Wrote: You might try E-Bay UK for some used ones. I managed to get one from the extra head I had. All the rest of the pre-chambers were okay upon inspection.

If i fixed all the stuff just to not be able to get a prechamber i might just lose it.

Do you need just one? I could sell you one of my used spares.
02-17-2019, 03:22 PM
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