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c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
mantahead Offline
Holset
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#1
c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
hi,
i have done some work on a c250 for a guy, pump is standard 6mm, for now.
turbo is kkk from Man truck
stainless 2.5inch straight through exhaust.
more fuel added by potentiometer.
custom downpipe.

[Image: SU1HMDE1NzYtMjAxMzA1MDYtMTYxNC5qcGc_zps3e90e4c4.jpg]

[Image: SU1HMDE1NzUtMjAxMzA1MDYtMTQyNy5qcGc_zps4689465c.jpg]

[Image: SU1HMDE1ODItMjAxMzA1MDctMTQzNS5qcGc_zpsc0a2cc80.jpg]

[Image: SU1HMDE1ODMtMjAxMzA1MDgtMTIwMS5qcGc_zpsad8a80f2.jpg]

[Image: SU1HMDE1ODUtMjAxMzA1MDgtMTQ0Ny5qcGc_zpsbd3f4af7.jpg]

went to the dyno today and i soon discovered from my egts and some experience that pump timing is out. Under further investigation i discovered some red paint marks on crank pulley, o dear, pump has been taken off by someone who doesn't know where timing marks are.Huh

power started of at 188bhp and after a small advance i had 205bhp with 260 ft lb.
egts came down nearly 200degrees.

so, tomorrow i will check timing and maybe have to remove pump and fit correctly, i am nearly sure timing is still out.

[Image: SU1HMDE1ODYtMjAxMzA1MDgtMTY1Mi5qcGc_zps2c8f6db6.jpg]
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2013, 03:56 PM by mantahead.)
05-08-2013, 03:40 PM
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bruno_pinho Offline
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#2
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp.
interesting ...
I got 260hp with original 6mm pump

not only agree with potencimetro, the car is accelerated and the lame work ... with Reprogramation is better
05-08-2013, 04:01 PM
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mantahead Offline
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#3
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
260.
that is good power for standard pump, what is the max rpm you can get with remap?
(This post was last modified: 05-08-2013, 04:13 PM by mantahead.)
05-08-2013, 04:09 PM
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mantahead Offline
Holset
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#4
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
any wonder pump timing is out, no timing pointer on engine.
[Image: SU1HMDE1ODgtMjAxMzA1MDktMTU0MC5qcGc_zps0182431f.jpg]
05-09-2013, 11:21 AM
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dcm Offline
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#5
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
Good results so far, is everything else standard, intercooler?
What's the plan for the timing, how did someone manage that?
05-10-2013, 03:19 PM
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mantahead Offline
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#6
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-10-2013, 03:19 PM)dcm Wrote: Good results so far, is everything else standard, intercooler?
What's the plan for the timing, how did someone manage that?
standard intercooler at the minute.
i have timing pointer now fitted from another old engine and have no idea why someone would remove it.Huh
going by the dirt in the threads, its been missing for a while.

pump coming off on monday. timing light says 16 degrees btdc.
would like to try some more advance.
(This post was last modified: 05-10-2013, 06:07 PM by mantahead.)
05-10-2013, 06:06 PM
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yorkshire1 Offline
s202 2.5TD manual high speed diff
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#7
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-10-2013, 06:06 PM)mantahead Wrote:
(05-10-2013, 03:19 PM)dcm Wrote: Good results so far, is everything else standard, intercooler?
What's the plan for the timing, how did someone manage that?
standard intercooler at the minute.
i have timing pointer now fitted from another old engine and have no idea why someone would remove it.Huh
going by the dirt in the threads, its been missing for a while.

pump coming off on monday. timing light says 16 degrees btdc.
would like to try some more advance.

nice job there Manta, Ive a 250 estate "98 manual put a 2.88 diff in and had ECU chip upgrade and DPF guts removed allegedly 175Hp 80mph @ 2500rpm now, because of gearing Im not using this engines ideal rev range for torque I need it <1500-2000+ and not 2000+
It pulls like a train over 2000 but terrible under and need to sort it, does your conversion with the KKK give better lower down boost, is it from a 7.5 tonner with manifold pressure driven wastegate ,cheers
05-12-2013, 05:04 PM
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mantahead Offline
Holset
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#8
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
hi Yorkshire1,
it isn't great in lower revs but once it spools it pulls like a train through all the gears.
more rpm would be good.
yea, pressure wastegate from 7.5 ton MAN.

turbo size beside original.

[Image: SU1HMDE1NTUtMjAxMzA0MjUtMDkzNC5qcGc_zpsf9fac48b.jpg]

[Image: SU1HMDE1NTQtMjAxMzA0MjUtMDkzNC5qcGc_zps06fa8eec.jpg]

[Image: SU1HMDE1NTAtMjAxMzA0MjQtMTU1Ni5qcGc_zps428496ba.jpg]

link pipe.
[Image: SU1HMDE1NDUtMjAxMzA0MjQtMTUwMy5qcGc_zpsa4b42ad9.jpg]
(This post was last modified: 05-12-2013, 05:30 PM by mantahead.)
05-12-2013, 05:25 PM
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yorkshire1 Offline
s202 2.5TD manual high speed diff
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#9
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-12-2013, 05:25 PM)mantahead Wrote: hi Yorkshire1,
it isn't great in lower revs but once it spools it pulls like a train through all the gears.
more rpm would be good.
yea, pressure wastegate from 7.5 ton MAN.

turbo size beside original.

yeah, Im trying to get common rail like acceleration at the lower end may have to go with variable vane perhaps , nice welding on that metalwork by the way ,when you welded that exhaust manifold up did you have to heat it up first or is it just maleable cast, I just feel something can be done about the lower end dead area cos its a real killer. itd be nice to hang onto 4th and 5th more without giving 3rd a hammering on inclines corners

[Image: SU1HMDE1NTUtMjAxMzA0MjUtMDkzNC5qcGc_zpsf9fac48b.jpg]

[Image: SU1HMDE1NTQtMjAxMzA0MjUtMDkzNC5qcGc_zps06fa8eec.jpg]

[Image: SU1HMDE1NTAtMjAxMzA0MjQtMTU1Ni5qcGc_zps428496ba.jpg]

link pipe.
[Image: SU1HMDE1NDUtMjAxMzA0MjQtMTUwMy5qcGc_zpsa4b42ad9.jpg]
05-13-2013, 02:59 AM
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Duncansport Offline
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#10
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
Darn nice welds there Mantahead! Really need to get the shop a AC/DC TIG.
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05-13-2013, 05:34 AM
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mantahead Offline
Holset
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#11
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-13-2013, 05:34 AM)Duncansport Wrote: Darn nice welds there Mantahead! Really need to get the shop a AC/DC TIG.
cheers,
still trying to get it set perfect yet.
05-13-2013, 06:51 AM
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mantahead Offline
Holset
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#12
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
got the timing sorted, not much more power but lower exhaust temperatures.(650c)
maybe try a remap and get the revs up a bit and see what happens.
here is graph.[Image: SU1HMDE2MDEtMjAxMzA1MTUtMTE0My5qcGc_zps2b2096f6.jpg]
05-15-2013, 05:27 PM
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swecias Offline
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#13
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-15-2013, 05:27 PM)mantahead Wrote: got the timing sorted, not much more power but lower exhaust temperatures.(650c)
maybe try a remap and get the revs up a bit and see what happens.
here is graph.[Image: SU1HMDE2MDEtMjAxMzA1MTUtMTE0My5qcGc_zps2b2096f6.jpg]

how much boost do you have ? whats beckpresure ? with 6mm elements modified mechanical pump i'm geting ~150cc of fuel
05-15-2013, 11:36 PM
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mantahead Offline
Holset
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#14
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
hi, boost is 1.5 bar, no backpressure gauge, potentiometer not giving so much fuel, i think a remap will help.
you must have modified delivery valves to get 150cc. what is your EGTS?
05-16-2013, 03:23 AM
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mantahead Offline
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#15
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
shortened the intercooler pipes and removed that pipe that the turbo was heating up. made a new pipe out of aluminium, and onto stainless bend and 90 degree silicone.
not much room for clearance with bonnet and washer bottle.
[Image: SU1HMDE2MTMtMjAxMzA1MTYtMTUxNy5qcGc_zps65f0a6e8.jpg]
[Image: SU1HMDE2MTYtMjAxMzA1MTYtMTUzOS5qcGc_zps7f30dc76.jpg]
[Image: SU1HMDE2MTktMjAxMzA1MTYtMTUzOS5qcGc_zps955729cb.jpg]
05-16-2013, 12:12 PM
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swecias Offline
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#16
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-16-2013, 03:23 AM)mantahead Wrote: hi, boost is 1.5 bar, no backpressure gauge, potentiometer not giving so much fuel, i think a remap will help.
you must have modified delivery valves to get 150cc. what is your EGTS?

yes delivery valves was modifiet Smile
05-16-2013, 01:20 PM
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Duncansport Offline
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#17
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
How loud is this thing with open exhaust?
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05-16-2013, 01:38 PM
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mantahead Offline
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#18
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-16-2013, 01:38 PM)Duncansport Wrote: How loud is this thing with open exhaust?
not that loud, not like petrol car.
05-16-2013, 03:33 PM
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anto Offline
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#19
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
What was the original turbo on it mantahead?
Nice bit of fab/ welding as well!
05-17-2013, 12:12 PM
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mantahead Offline
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#20
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-17-2013, 12:12 PM)anto Wrote: What was the original turbo on it mantahead?
Nice bit of fab/ welding as well!

cheers,
think its garrett, some are kkk.
some guys use them as an upgrade 306 peugeot. Think its because of the 3 bolt flange.
05-17-2013, 04:14 PM
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anto Offline
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#21
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
Is it a t25?
A few lads i know have the kkk off the 300. If you ream out the hotside of the 306 kkk itl slot right in.
Very easy upgrade but they arent easy to find!
If you have any lying around let me know...

Any thoughts on making that an mtdi? Do away with the electrics?
05-17-2013, 04:42 PM
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mantahead Offline
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#22
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-17-2013, 04:42 PM)anto Wrote: Is it a t25?
A few lads i know have the kkk off the 300. If you ream out the hotside of the 306 kkk itl slot right in.
Very easy upgrade but they arent easy to find!
If you have any lying around let me know...

Any thoughts on making that an mtdi? Do away with the electrics?
i will find out.
mtdi?? mechanical pump?
would like to, dont know if auto box will be happy.
05-17-2013, 05:23 PM
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anto Offline
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#23
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
Yeah mechanical pump.
Although they dont control the smoke as well as an electrically controlled pump i far rather prefer mech for its simplicity. No sensors to go wrong etc and with regards smoke control, thats what the right foot is for.
05-17-2013, 05:40 PM
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dcm Offline
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#24
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-17-2013, 04:42 PM)anto Wrote: Is it a t25?
A few lads i know have the kkk off the 300. If you ream out the hotside of the 306 kkk itl slot right in.
Very easy upgrade but they arent easy to find!
If you have any lying around let me know...

Any thoughts on making that an mtdi? Do away with the electrics?

From what I've seen C250s have a Garrett GT25C fitted and E300's have KKK K14 turbos with the same 3 bolt flange.
05-18-2013, 07:34 AM
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Hario' Offline
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#25
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
I'm literally about to buy a 250td estate with 722.6 to superturbodiesel, can I ask how you fooled the ecu when you switched to mechanical pump?

Retained the rack potentiometer from the electronic pump and connected it to mech linkeage? Or does the ecu just work with it disconnected?

Any info mucky obliged!

H



Installed:

OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. 
[/i]
02-13-2014, 04:45 PM
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mantahead Offline
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#26
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(02-13-2014, 04:45 PM)Hario Wrote: I'm literally about to buy a 250td estate with 722.6 to superturbodiesel, can I ask how you fooled the ecu when you switched to mechanical pump?

Retained the rack potentiometer from the electronic pump and connected it to mech linkeage? Or does the ecu just work with it disconnected?

Any info mucky obliged!

H
hi,
this car had electronic pump.
02-14-2014, 05:32 PM
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anjay Offline
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#27
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
How do you install the potentiometer to controll rate of injection? I am researching how to raise
fueling on my 606 and I didnt find anything so far about using potentiometer.
Would you be so kind to provide some info describing it. I bet few of us could use it on DD.
1977 300D for parts? Just a pile of rust but still runs!
1984 190D 2.2 - winter ride
1987 300TD - tinker toy
1991 300TD - unmoded and best on MPG
1992 300TD - semi-STD(Goran modified 7.5 ip but still with factory turbo+at)
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02-14-2014, 10:24 PM
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bigbortha Offline
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#28
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
The correct wires are identified by scrolling down on the thread below Smile

http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/Thre...c-governor

several people had carried this out with mixed results
02-15-2014, 01:57 AM
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Stevo-trendy Offline
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#29
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
Any updates on this car had anymore map work done ?
03-17-2014, 03:18 AM
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Hario' Offline
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#30
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(02-13-2014, 04:45 PM)Hario Wrote: I'm literally about to buy a 250td estate with 722.6 to superturbodiesel, can I ask how you fooled the ecu when you switched to mechanical pump?

Retained the rack potentiometer from the electronic pump and connected it to mech linkeage? Or does the ecu just work with it disconnected?

Any info mucky obliged!

H

Oh my mistake I thought this was your owh vehicle mantahead.



Installed:

OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. 
[/i]
03-17-2014, 12:48 PM
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john Offline
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#31
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
about timing mark.
I dont hink the late om606/605 with electric pump had it. I didnt on my 98. iginition is set with the thingy on the flywheel and special mercedes tool connected to the pump accordingly to mercedes manual.
Holset power!
03-17-2014, 03:56 PM
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mantahead Offline
Holset
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#32
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(03-17-2014, 03:56 PM)john Wrote: about timing mark.
I dont hink the late om606/605 with electric pump had it. I didnt on my 98. iginition is set with the thingy on the flywheel and special mercedes tool connected to the pump accordingly to mercedes manual.

my other 2 om605 engines had pointer for timing mark and had electric pump.
03-19-2014, 04:15 PM
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Gforce Offline
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#33
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
i changed the waterpump on my 603 last week and i had to remove the timing marker to get to the last bolt, maybe they didn't put it back with you when the have changed the waterpump
03-19-2014, 11:39 PM
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Hario' Offline
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#34
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
Yeah my E300 had a timing pointer I had to remove to replace water pump.

Probably dodgy garages not replacing it after water pump replacement.



Installed:

OM606/722.6, big IC, W220 brakes.
Planned:
DIY manifold, compound, 722.6 controller, built IP.
[i]Less rust.. 
[/i]
03-22-2014, 02:55 PM
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Ecto Offline
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#35
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
(05-16-2013, 12:12 PM)mantahead Wrote: shortened the intercooler pipes and removed that pipe that the turbo was heating up. made a new pipe out of aluminium, and onto stainless bend and 90 degree silicone.
not much room for clearance with bonnet and washer bottle.
[Image: SU1HMDE2MTMtMjAxMzA1MTYtMTUxNy5qcGc_zps65f0a6e8.jpg]
[Image: SU1HMDE2MTYtMjAxMzA1MTYtMTUzOS5qcGc_zps7f30dc76.jpg]
[Image: SU1HMDE2MTktMjAxMzA1MTYtMTUzOS5qcGc_zps955729cb.jpg]

Hi,

I've got a question.
You tested a straight pipe above the turbo between intake manifold and original plastic pressure-out from the intercooler and also the self welded pipe from above (that one next to the water tank). Was there any improvement with your self-welded pipe? I have also thought about both options you've mentioned, that's why i'm asking.

How was the improvement on removing the AGR inlet and replacing against the straight pipe?

greets
Ecto
06-26-2018, 08:55 AM
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orion Offline
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#36
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
Do you have installed a KKK K16 charger? For my understanding 215Hp are very less for this big charger
11-01-2018, 01:30 PM
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Jberryman Offline
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#37
RE: c250 om605 200+bhp. 6mm element
Hey, I have 20psi of boost and a remapped 6mm edc pump and only got 150hp on the dyno, think I have a fuelling problem??
11-06-2018, 10:39 PM
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