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Norwegian OM606 build - Printable Version

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RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 10-06-2013

The HE300WG looks like this:

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It has a watercooled core, 4" v-band dp, very small light weight turbine, much smaller than the hx35 so it will be fun to se how early it spoolsBig Grin It can handle pressure of pr:5 and flows almost 70 lbs/min. I have the compressormap but that is not for public^^


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - mantahead - 10-06-2013

hi,
nice one, hope you get some use from those governor weights.:Cool


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 10-06-2013

It would be very interesting to compare the HE300WG map to efr 7163 Wink
why do you want to inject water /methanol between the LP and HP stage
No after and intercooler?
Nice pump Sad)


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 10-07-2013

(10-06-2013, 05:20 PM)Turbo It would be very interesting to compare the HE300WG map to efr 7163 Wink
why do you want to inject water /methanol between the LP and HP stage
No after and intercooler?
Nice pump Sad)

Sorry, the compmap isn`t for the publicSad
But i can tell you that it is a bit wider, starting from the same lbs/min and the holset can handle one bar extra... The pr peak is at the same place, but the holset is at pr:5 where the efr is only 4. The holset holds that peak quit longBig Grin
if this is the compmap:
http://www.turbodriven.com/performanceturbos/matchbot/images/71x80.jpg

I don`t know if i have room for an intercooler between the stages, but time will tellWink


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 10-08-2013

Yes, to fit intercooler is a real challenge specially if one is to use an aftercooler as well with is quite good in point to gain some efficiency or less need of drive pressure depending how you want to put it.

The efr 7163 has a mass ratio about 6 if we consider 0,08kg/s to 0,45kg/s from pr2 to pr 3, as what I have seen that wide is quite good but I have not seen the HX300W so I can not say anything about that one. The back side to efr 7163 is it poor capability to handle surge but it has titanium turbine wheel and diagonal turbine construction so back pressure is less going to be affected by the turbos rpm and ball bering will aslo help spool time. for om606.962 13psi at 1600rpm and goes by it self up to 4000rpm at 40psi so by suitable LP turbo it has no problem to come along up to 7000-8000rpm with a flow of 100lbs/min if it is desired without need to be shut down before.

If you are going to run the turbo quite by them self I can understand you need for high pressure ratio for HP unit but a high pressure compressor design is going to have trade of in other areas. if we consider constant polytropical efficiency for the compressor design is-entropic efficiency is always going to drop from best efficiency point with increasing presser ratio. The really hard part is that no manufacturer, that I know of, show openly there turbine map, and holset is even hard to find the compressor maps as well. If you have enough information on the unit in hand you can put it in borg warners matchbot to play to see how it comes out to make an early prediction of performance for the engine, of course the program have some limitation but it is quite fun to see the difference of different setups

It is going to be very interesting to follow you build, keep up the good work

(10-07-2013, 05:30 AM)EDH_Performance
(10-06-2013, 05:20 PM)Turbo It would be very interesting to compare the HE300WG map to efr 7163 Wink
why do you want to inject water /methanol between the LP and HP stage
No after and intercooler?
Nice pump Sad)

Sorry, the compmap isn`t for the publicSad
But i can tell you that it is a bit wider, starting from the same lbs/min and the holset can handle one bar extra... The pr peak is at the same place, but the holset is at pr:5 where the efr is only 4. The holset holds that peak quit longBig Grin
if this is the compmap:
http://www.turbodriven.com/performanceturbos/matchbot/images/71x80.jpg

I don`t know if i have room for an intercooler between the stages, but time will tellWink



RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 10-29-2013

Here is the FINAL layout for the manifold. With this manifold everything fits under the hood...Almost!

Use a couple of hours to tackweld something togheter:

[Image: 20131027_170416_zps4ec099b2.jpg]
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The manifold needs alot of work, and the two collectors needs alot of work to sort out the gasflow!
The challenge is to make room for 2x50mm wg and keep the flow under controlBig Grin

Stay tuned!


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - raysorenson - 10-29-2013

I've read that the 6 into 1 collector isn't the best. Good to see someone trying to squeeze 2 collectors under the hood.


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 10-30-2013

(10-29-2013, 11:32 AM)raysorenson I've read that the 6 into 1 collector isn't the best. Good to see someone trying to squeeze 2 collectors under the hood.

Hi, a split collector is the preffered way to go yes! But since the turbo has such a small exhausthousing and it is singel entery it had to be like thisBig Grin


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Ksteen2 - 10-30-2013

looks good as always, soon to be working now? Wink


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 12-28-2013

Hahah, new route again! But this time i promiss it will be the final setup!
3 sequential turbo setup!

Custom built bypass-valve:
[Image: 20131227_213806_zpsb2cd7713.jpg]
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Plan is to have a nice torq curve from 1500rpm and full power up to 8000rpm!


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - erling66 - 12-28-2013

You never stop to surpriseSmile Great inspiration for us normal people who only work a few hours each day on our projectsUndecided
With 3 turbos I guess your whole dash will be full of instruments to control everything, and you will need a few buddy's to watch them while you try to keep this thing on the roadTongue


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Triker - 12-28-2013

Nice going man! Smile Keep up the good work.


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - MFSuper90 - 12-28-2013

Holset he221, and what are the other two?


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 12-28-2013

(12-28-2013, 01:05 PM)MFSuper90 Holset he221, and what are the other two?

Holset HE221 with custom exhausthousing, Holset HE300 and HX60 with custom housing.

HE221 exhaust housing:
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Just need to weld v-band clamps in both ends of the housingBig Grin

How they sit in the car:
[Image: 20131228_191451_zpseff94dd5.jpg]


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 12-28-2013

Must say I am very curious about how you are going to fit all that under the hood, and even more how you are going to put it togetherSmile I have serious problem to fit two two turbos intercooler and aftercooler in a good way and you have three turbos
keep up the good work


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 12-28-2013

(12-28-2013, 04:42 PM)Turbo Must say I am very curious about how you are going to fit all that under the hood, and even more how you are going to put it togetherSmile I have serious problem to fit two two turbos intercooler and aftercooler in a good way and you have three turbos
keep up the good work

Hehe, you need some challenges in life^^
Will be fun to see when the smallest turbo will spoolSmile I can adjust some with the housing but i can't surgeSmile


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 12-28-2013

Hehe, you need some challenges in life
Quote:" could have not said it better my self Tongue

"Will be fun to see when the smallest turbo will spoolSmile" I can adjust some with the housing but i can't surgeSmile

You mean you have not calculated when it start to spool?
surge problem can be dealt with, if you just know how to do Cool


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 12-28-2013

(12-28-2013, 06:07 PM)Turbo Hehe, you need some challenges in life
Quote:" could have not said it better my self Tongue

"Will be fun to see when the smallest turbo will spoolSmile" I can adjust some with the housing but i can't surgeSmile

You mean you have not calculated when it start to spool?
surge problem can be dealt with, if you just know how to do Cool

I am not the guy that sits inside and calculate when the turbo spools! Waste of timeSmile
Build, try and make a good and learnfull experience out of itBig Grin

(12-28-2013, 06:07 PM)Turbo Hehe, you need some challenges in life
Quote:" could have not said it better my self Tongue

"Will be fun to see when the smallest turbo will spoolSmile" I can adjust some with the housing but i can't surgeSmile

You mean you have not calculated when it start to spool?
surge problem can be dealt with, if you just know how to do Cool

Hehe, i machined antisurge in mye first setup, and there is alot more ways to remove the surge

(12-28-2013, 06:07 PM)Turbo Hehe, you need some challenges in life
Quote:" could have not said it better my self Tongue

"Will be fun to see when the smallest turbo will spoolSmile" I can adjust some with the housing but i can't surgeSmile

You mean you have not calculated when it start to spool?
surge problem can be dealt with, if you just know how to do Cool

Hehe, i machined antisurge in mye first setup, and there is alot more ways to remove the surge

(12-28-2013, 06:07 PM)Turbo Hehe, you need some challenges in life
Quote:" could have not said it better my self Tongue

"Will be fun to see when the smallest turbo will spoolSmile" I can adjust some with the housing but i can't surgeSmile

You mean you have not calculated when it start to spool?
surge problem can be dealt with, if you just know how to do Cool

I am not the guy that sits inside and calculate when the turbo spools! Waste of timeSmile
Build, try and make a good and learnfull experience out of itBig Grin


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 12-28-2013

well some calculations for me can save a lot of time and money and the ability to better performance predicate to retch your goals, but we are all different
I like to build and develop things, it comes a time for all of us when repair is not that fun any more, at least so it has been for me. Simply I am just a poor bastard and need to maximise my resources so I can get something nice ...

Very interesting how you going to make them work, are you going to use them together all the way or shall your HX60 take all in the end?


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 12-28-2013

(12-28-2013, 07:41 PM)Turbo well some calculations for me can save a lot of time and money and the ability to better performance predicate to retch your goals, but we are all different
I like to build and develop things, it comes a time for all of us when repair is not that fun any more, at least so it has been for me. Simply I am just a poor bastard and need to maximise my resources so I can get something nice ...

Very interesting how you going to make them work, are you going to use them together all the way or shall your HX60 take all in the end?

The hx60 will take over in the end in this secound setup. Maybe i will change to a turbo that can support more boost...But first thing first, get this thing to boost^^


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - erling66 - 12-29-2013

Not many people take new turbos and chop them up into pieces just because they are not satisfied with the way they are build, but this is how progress is made so continue your great work DanielSmile


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 12-29-2013

(12-29-2013, 06:02 AM)erling66 Not many people take new turbos and chop them up into pieces just because they are not satisfied with the way they are build, but this is how progress is made so continue your great work DanielSmile

Hehe, you should come over soon ErlingWink


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - hansebanger77 - 12-29-2013

Looking awesome ! Keep up that nice work and tripple spool up that crazy thing


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 12-29-2013

Daniel possesses great decisiveness to put things together we have all seen many times like many other here on the forum for that matter, I am just puzzled why he do not calculate more on the turbo part since these things is relative complex and the more turbo you ad the more degrees of freedom will come with them and they do not by nature work by it self that I am sure a lot of has experience in the past. And he is not like some finish meaning that he love secretiveness to obsession, but that is my personal opinion.

In my own project I have doing some calculating for 6 month before I have found something that can start to match that performance I am looking for, and I guess there will still need some tuning in the end, but I have narrow it reasonably close. Perhaps Daniel has some magical powers that are up for reveal, I sure looking forward to see them here Smile


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 12-29-2013

(12-29-2013, 06:02 AM)erling66 Not many people take new turbos and chop them up into pieces just because they are not satisfied with the way they are build, but this is how progress is made so continue your great work DanielSmile

Hehe, you should come over soon ErlingWink

(12-29-2013, 09:01 AM)Turbo Daniel possesses great decisiveness to put things together we have all seen many times like many other here on the forum for that matter, I am just puzzled why he do not calculate more on the turbo part since these things is relative complex and the more turbo you ad the more degrees of freedom will come with them and they do not by nature work by it self that I am sure a lot of has experience in the past. And he is not like some finish meaning that he love secretiveness to obsession, but that is my personal opinion.

In my own project I have doing some calculating for 6 month before I have found something that can start to match that performance I am looking for, and I guess there will still need some tuning in the end, but I have narrow it reasonably close. Perhaps Daniel has some magical powers that are up for reveal, I sure looking forward to see them here Smile

All three turbos are sized based on their compressormaps.
And all this building don't cost me much, just time...6 months is a long time for me, i would rather spend all that time fabricating my setup based on some small calculations than have it all on paper and nothing in the car.....Just my opinion^^


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - DiseaselWeasel - 12-29-2013

Many ways lead to Rome Smile Some go try&error, some do science, some do a little of both - the result is what matters Smile


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 12-29-2013

(12-29-2013, 12:01 PM)DiseaselWeasel Many ways lead to Rome Smile Some go try&error, some do science, some do a little of both - the result is what matters Smile

Totally true mate, the dyno graph shows it all in the end^^ And along the way, have fun building itBig Grin


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Booster - 12-30-2013

This will be great fun when done, can't wait to see how it drives!

No matter how it drives in the end if you don't do it, you'll never know!


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 12-30-2013

everything do not show on a dyno, simply when you let go of of the gas and push on again how fast the boost will build up again never shows on the dyno, that crisp responess is great for a daily driver.

(12-29-2013, 01:27 PM)EDH_Performance
(12-29-2013, 12:01 PM)DiseaselWeasel Many ways lead to Rome Smile Some go try&error, some do science, some do a little of both - the result is what matters Smile

Totally true mate, the dyno graph shows it all in the end^^ And along the way, have fun building itBig Grin



RE: Norwegian OM606 build - john - 12-30-2013

(12-28-2013, 07:41 PM)Turbo well some calculations for me can save a lot of time and money and the ability to better performance predicate to retch your goals, but we are all different
I like to build and develop things, it comes a time for all of us when repair is not that fun any more, at least so it has been for me. Simply I am just a poor bastard and need to maximise my resources so I can get something nice ...

Very interesting how you going to make them work, are you going to use them together all the way or shall your HX60 take all in the end?

He is from norway, he is made of money Big Grin


Is the goal with trippelturbos more hp and more boost or just better driveability?
Do you think the stenparner rods will hold?


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Tito - 12-30-2013

I can't describe how awesome this is... I would murder someone to have a ride in the passenger seat Blush


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 01-01-2014

(12-30-2013, 02:38 PM)Turbo everything do not show on a dyno, simply when you let go of of the gas and push on again how fast the boost will build up again never shows on the dyno, that crisp responess is great for a daily driver.

(12-29-2013, 01:27 PM)EDH_Performance
(12-29-2013, 12:01 PM)DiseaselWeasel Many ways lead to Rome Smile Some go try&error, some do science, some do a little of both - the result is what matters Smile

Totally true mate, the dyno graph shows it all in the end^^ And along the way, have fun building itBig Grin

If that little 60mm he221 not spools fast i must have done something really wrongSmile

(12-30-2013, 07:13 PM)john
(12-28-2013, 07:41 PM)Turbo well some calculations for me can save a lot of time and money and the ability to better performance predicate to retch your goals, but we are all different
I like to build and develop things, it comes a time for all of us when repair is not that fun any more, at least so it has been for me. Simply I am just a poor bastard and need to maximise my resources so I can get something nice ...

Very interesting how you going to make them work, are you going to use them together all the way or shall your HX60 take all in the end?

He is from norway, he is made of money Big Grin


Is the goal with trippelturbos more hp and more boost or just better driveability?
Do you think the stenparner rods will hold?

Not made of money, just have good acsess to cheap materials and have things laying around^^

The point of trippel turbo is to have full boost from very low rpm up to high rpm...And at the same time be one of a kindWink

The sten parner motor rods are shit and will be replaced with som beefy rods...Rods are under manufacturingWink


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - larsalan - 01-01-2014

^ surely not one of a kind. BMW had the same idea Wink

http://www.gizmag.com/bmw-adds-four-triple-turbo-diesel-performance-m-cars/21227/


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 01-01-2014

(01-01-2014, 10:35 AM)larsalan ^ surely not one of a kind. BMW had the same idea Wink

http://www.gizmag.com/bmw-adds-four-triple-turbo-diesel-performance-m-cars/21227/

I know, i meant a one of a kind om606Wink


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 01-01-2014

Well when out going to hit higher rpm and go of the throttle and go back on again there you going to notice that the smallets turbo is out of the way there and can not help you any thing, I have not seen your maps so I can not see exactly where this two areas specially noticeable is going to be for you, believe me they are very well noticeably, this can easy be experienced in a BMW 535D with R2S system

If that little 60mm he221 not spools fast i must have done something really wrongSmile




RE: Norwegian OM606 build - john - 01-03-2014

(01-01-2014, 09:19 AM)EDH_Performance Not made of money, just have good acsess to cheap materials and have things laying around^^

The point of trippel turbo is to have full boost from very low rpm up to high rpm...And at the same time be one of a kindWink

The sten parner motor rods are shit and will be replaced with som beefy rods...Rods are under manufacturingWink

You will most defenetly be a one ofCoolCool Looks sick

Never heard of anyone braking those rods but everyone says they are crap Tongue


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 01-06-2014

(01-03-2014, 03:49 PM)john
(01-01-2014, 09:19 AM)EDH_Performance Not made of money, just have good acsess to cheap materials and have things laying around^^

The point of trippel turbo is to have full boost from very low rpm up to high rpm...And at the same time be one of a kindWink

The sten parner motor rods are shit and will be replaced with som beefy rods...Rods are under manufacturingWink

You will most defenetly be a one ofCoolCool Looks sick

Never heard of anyone braking those rods but everyone says they are crap Tongue

The problem with those rods are the upper part, they are very thin around the bushing...So the stretch when revving too high^^

The last picture with the turbos was wrong, this is how the needs to sit! had a few buddies in the workshop to plan and look for problems...All turbos are mounted to the engine block so all the pipe work can be done while the engine is on a enginestandWink

[Image: 20140104_173004_zps408218c5.jpg]
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RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 01-06-2014

nice intercooler made it your self?


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 01-06-2014

(01-06-2014, 05:23 AM)Turbo nice intercooler made it your self?

No, bought it from USA...It is to be mounted on my 18 feet OM606 flat bottom dragster boat^^


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 01-06-2014

manufacturer?

(01-06-2014, 08:18 AM)EDH_Performance
(01-06-2014, 05:23 AM)Turbo nice intercooler made it your self?

No, bought it from USA...It is to be mounted on my 18 feet OM606 flat bottom dragster boat^^



RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 01-07-2014

(01-06-2014, 03:03 PM)Turbo manufacturer?

(01-06-2014, 08:18 AM)EDH_Performance
(01-06-2014, 05:23 AM)Turbo nice intercooler made it your self?

No, bought it from USA...It is to be mounted on my 18 feet OM606 flat bottom dragster boat^^
I have no clue, sorry! But what about klracing.se?


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - lgreeley83 - 01-07-2014

3 turbos! I can't wait!


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - raysorenson - 01-07-2014

CXracing is an American (likely chinese mfg) company that makes tons of cheap IC's and that looks just like one they sell.


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Turbo - 01-07-2014

klracing is most china intercooler but most significant all of those I have found have wrong measurement.
I need to fit both after, intercooler and radiator and the cooler after LP turbo need to to have connection from up to down to make the piping reasonably. and it will be at least 5" thick because of pressure losses, total area available is 500*780 and it need to be able to cool the boosted air of about 250kw and the heat from the cooling liquid for cooing the engine. Your looked quite thick there of my interest.

If you just have basic heat transfer and pressure drop characteristics it is easy to calculate your performance for the intercooler or any onther heat exchanger, but that kind of calculation seams for most people that sell intercoolers to be science fiction

(01-07-2014, 02:56 AM)EDH_Performance
(01-06-2014, 03:03 PM)Turbo manufacturer?

(01-06-2014, 08:18 AM)EDH_Performance No, bought it from USA...It is to be mounted on my 18 feet OM606 flat bottom dragster boat^^
I have no clue, sorry! But what about klracing.se?



RE: Norwegian OM606 build - pmj4147 - 02-23-2014

(01-06-2014, 03:39 AM)EDH_Performance
(01-03-2014, 03:49 PM)john
(01-01-2014, 09:19 AM)EDH_Performance Not made of money, just have good acsess to cheap materials and have things laying around^^

The point of trippel turbo is to have full boost from very low rpm up to high rpm...And at the same time be one of a kindWink

The sten parner motor rods are shit and will be replaced with som beefy rods...Rods are under manufacturingWink

You will most defenetly be a one ofCoolCool Looks sick

Never heard of anyone braking those rods but everyone says they are crap Tongue

The problem with those rods are the upper part, they are very thin around the bushing...So the stretch when revving too high^^

The last picture with the turbos was wrong, this is how the needs to sit! had a few buddies in the workshop to plan and look for problems...All turbos are mounted to the engine block so all the pipe work can be done while the engine is on a enginestandWink

[Image: 20140104_173004_zps408218c5.jpg]
[Image: 20140104_173012_zps22244b5a.jpg]
[Image: 20140104_173037_zps5b9a18de.jpg]
[Image: 20140104_173047_zps89b17a76.jpg]



How did you deal with Oil pressure???


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - EDH_Performance - 02-24-2014

Only one way to go, custom drysump systemWink


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - Simpler=Better - 02-25-2014

(02-24-2014, 10:37 PM)EDH_Performance Only one way to go, custom drysump systemWink

Please take pictures


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - hooblah - 02-28-2014

Love the build! I'd love to attempt something crazy like this if I had the skill, time and space Tongue

Can I ask what mounts and arms you're using, or what you were originally using to squeeze the 606 in? And what radiator are you using? And what's the depth of the intercooler?

Reason I ask is because i'm having trouble getting my engine in. Im using 602 arms but the gearbox is interfering with the tunnel and not allowing the engine to go further back.

Do you have the power steering connected? I didnt notice the pump, unless you've moved it? I can see this causing a problem with clearance, which is why you may have gotten rid of it altogether.

If I could direct your attention to this thread, please take a look and feel free to make a suggestion or two Wink
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/Thread-How-the-hell-have-people-managed-to-squeeze-an-om606-into-a-w201?pid=61398#pid61398


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - DiseaselWeasel - 04-20-2014

So - is it runing??


RE: Norwegian OM606 build - winmutt - 05-29-2014

Bump...