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+--- Thread: Bosch M and Mw pump theory (/showthread.php?tid=2770)
Bosch M and Mw pump theory - 300D50 - 07-03-2011
Please give your opinions.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QkAv-HFaLqpK_5wKCln6DODkfw_DkjBHVYZXm0nUtEw/edit?hl=en_US&authkey=CJXuhs0I
Many thanks to OM616 for putting his time and effort into putting together 99%+ of the information in this document.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Alastair E - 07-03-2011
Nice.....
But, Not enough about the 'M' pump specifically, for me!
We dont have the MW here at all as far as I know--Never seen one on M.B anyway!
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - 300D50 - 07-03-2011
Well, the basics should swap over since it's mostly the governor in the doc right now.
If anyone wants to add to the doc, let me know and I'll add you to the edit list.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - garage - 07-03-2011
Now thats some good stuff!!
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - 300D50 - 07-03-2011
(07-03-2011, 05:19 PM)garage Now thats some good stuff!!
See, good things do come to those who wait!
There will be more added over time, but one of the big things we need is some non-copyrighted photo's of pump guts, since most the ones from the other thread were sort of "hot"...
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Biohazard - 07-03-2011
That is a great explanation of how the pump internals work! Turns out I was right, I didn't know crap about the guts of a pump. LOL I had gotten lucky when I pulled the rack limiter out of my MW and felt an increase. Also explains why some folks here didn't feel anything. Thank you for your effort on this!!
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - led-panzer - 07-03-2011
Excellent document. Thank you very much OM616.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Syncro_G - 07-04-2011
That's a nice writeup. I like that it explains the controls of the pump.
Now that were seeing what not to do, it would be cool to distill a new step by step power tune procedure from it.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - 300D50 - 07-04-2011
It's all in there.
Start with a known working pump, document what you do, and follow the guidelines.
Tune a mans car, he's happy for a week.
Teach a man to tune his car, he's happy till he needs a larger turbo!
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Syncro_G - 07-04-2011
(07-04-2011, 05:31 PM)300D50 It's all in there.
Start with a known working pump, document what you do, and follow the guidelines.
Tune a mans car, he's happy for a week.
Teach a man to tune his car, he's happy till he needs a larger turbo!
I'll have to read it a few more times then.
Edit: on further thought and reading, what i gather is that several adjustments are interdependent.
That would worry me if I were to start messing with any of the settings.
So I would think there's a specific or recommended order to adjustment.
Should I assume that that procedure is covered in the official Bosch manual and this doc is supplemental to the official manual?
It's perfectly fair if this is the case but it should probably be stated explicitly -- something like a "how to use this doc" statement. Especially since the instructions we had a while back for RL removal were sort of a f*** the manual kind of deal.
Overall I'm pretty stoked on the information there.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - OM616 - 07-04-2011
(07-04-2011, 05:55 PM)Syncro_G(07-04-2011, 05:31 PM)300D50 It's all in there.
Start with a known working pump, document what you do, and follow the guidelines.
Tune a mans car, he's happy for a week.
Teach a man to tune his car, he's happy till he needs a larger turbo!
I'll have to read it a few more times then.
Edit: on further thought and reading, what i gather is that several adjustments are interdependent.
That would worry me if I were to start messing with any of the settings.
So I would think there's a specific or recommended order to adjustment.
Should I assume that that procedure is covered in the official Bosch manual and this doc is supplemental to the official manual?
It's perfectly fair if this is the case but it should probably be stated explicitly -- something like a "how to use this doc" statement. Especially since the instructions we had a while back for RL removal were sort of a f*** the manual kind of deal.
Overall I'm pretty stoked on the information there.
Bosch does have a specific order that they want their pump guys to do the adjustments.
As for making "performance" adjustments, I have developed a sequence that I make the adjustments, but it depends on what you want to adjust. I will not share my procedure, sorry.
Before I pull the back off of a RW, I get a feel for how the engine responds to the throttle, and then I pull the cover an make an "O SHIT" change, (make several adjustments at once based on experience and evaluation), Usually I have to go in one more time to fine tune one thing or another.
Nothing in the doc relates to the MW/RW manual. Everything in there we are throwing out the window. The doc is all from my understanding and experience, not Bosch.
I have had several cars towed to me to have me straighten out what the owner did to his governor. I super highly recommend that no one remove the back cover.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - randomdude - 07-05-2011
since a lot of this revolves around the "rack" can anyone post a pic of one? ive searched a while on google and not had good luck.
i may have seen it but not known what it was since this is my first time playing with IP's. but im tryin!!! lol.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - ronnie - 07-05-2011
The actual rack is hard to see without taking the ip apart. Thermo king diesels(made by izusu) Have a cover plate that you can see the rack itself. It looks like rack and pinion steering gears. What you most likely want to see is the rack limiter, and it adjustment. There is a good picture of it in one of the recent posts on this forum.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 07-06-2011
That is an awesome Read OM616. THANK YOU. It makes perfect sense.
One of the important things that stood out to me is that it seem thats TC and Max rpm should be, I would say, adjusted equally. Return to Idle seems easy enough to achieve
.... Now to put the rack limiter back in ....
Oh! Speaking of that, You had mentioned briefly on possibility of a SLIGHT rack limiter adjustment being made, but I did not see anything about it later. Is it something that will be added later?
Please understand I do not mean to push you here, Just trying to ask some intelligent questions. Give me some time, I will explore myself on my virgin (Rack limiter less) pump
Don't yell at me!
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - 300D50 - 07-06-2011
In this case, "slight adjustment" means you can adjust it to let the rack travel slightly further, and it should work.
We also need some back cover and side cover shots if anyone has their IP apart.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 07-06-2011
Give me a couple days, I will post some
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - MFSuper90 - 08-25-2011
(07-06-2011, 10:28 AM)Captain America Give me a couple days, I will post some
So did anyone every repost the back of a MW pump telling what is what? i really want to turn my pump up, but dont want to mess it all up
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - aaa - 08-25-2011
Somebody label this:
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/Thread-IP-Full-Load-Adjustment-Procedure-for-the-MW-and-M-pumps?pid=32698#pid32698
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - MFSuper90 - 08-25-2011
(08-25-2011, 03:45 PM)aaa Somebody label this:
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/Thread-IP-Full-Load-Adjustment-Procedure-for-the-MW-and-M-pumps?pid=32698#pid32698
I would, but i dont know which is which
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 08-25-2011
I think I have it correct
![[Image: MWPumpLabeled.png]](http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h183/foxcrf450rider/MWPumpLabeled.png)
And Forced, Douche's pic below:
[Edited for content. Sorry]
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - carlitosgy6 - 08-27-2011
(08-25-2011, 11:33 PM)Captain America I think I have it correctTHANK YOU I REALLY NEEDED THAT INFO!!!
And Forced, Douche's pic below:
[Edited for content. Sorry]
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 08-27-2011
(08-27-2011, 09:06 PM)carlitosgy6 THANK YOU I REALLY NEEDED THAT INFO!!!
Not a problem!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why cant his pic be up? "permission is granted to copy and/or distribute as long as this picture is not altered"
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - winmutt - 08-30-2011
(08-27-2011, 10:01 PM)Captain America Why cant his pic be up? "permission is granted to copy and/or distribute as long as this picture is not altered"Because I don't want any more headaches. Yours is going into the IP thread
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 08-30-2011
Easy enough! lol
When I finally get around to taking mine apart, I will take a pic with a clean IP and relabel
I tried to label it based on the terminology OM616 used in his pump theory document
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - carlitosgy6 - 08-30-2011
I can take a better pic if you want
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 08-30-2011
(08-30-2011, 07:43 PM)carlitosgy6 I can take a better pic if you want
Sure! If you are able to clean the oil off (brake clean?) and focus a tad better I think it would help a lot
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - MFSuper90 - 09-01-2011
Can someone please tell me how they broke the locking ring loose on the torque control? Last time i unsuccesfully tried, it was i giant PIA, and i gave up and everything back together because i had to have the car the next day
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - winmutt - 09-01-2011
IIRC I ground a socket down to fit.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - OM616 - 09-01-2011
(09-01-2011, 01:25 PM)winmutt IIRC I ground a socket down to fit.
Take a 13/16 spark plug socket and grind the end so it has two tabs about .100" wide, 180 degrees from each other. The tabs only need to be about .125 tall.
The spark plug socket is nice because it has a hex for a wrench. This is a nice feature on the 617.
Remember that the capsule will rotate when you loosen or tighten the lock ring. You must note its position prior to loosening the lock ring, and confirm its position after tightening the lock ring.
After you have the lock ring broken loose, (1/8 to ΒΌ turn), make sure that when you turn the capsule, the ring stays put, other wise the lock ring will move with the capsule, and when you go to tighten the lock ring, you will just be turning the capsule back in.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 09-01-2011
Thanks for the info OM616
Do you approve of the labeling on the pump picture?
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - OM616 - 09-01-2011
(09-01-2011, 04:20 PM)Captain America Thanks for the info OM616
Do you approve of the labeling on the pump picture?
Looks fine from where I'm sitting,
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - carlitosgy6 - 09-01-2011
ill do it tomorrow
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - MFSuper90 - 09-01-2011
thank you very much om616. I appreciate the document you typed up and all the information you provide. I dont think i would even come close to understanding a mw pump without your MW Theory
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RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 09-01-2011
(09-01-2011, 04:46 PM)OM616(09-01-2011, 04:20 PM)Captain America Thanks for the info OM616
Do you approve of the labeling on the pump picture?
Looks fine from where I'm sitting,
Your Blessing is much appreciated!
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - E300TSC - 09-12-2011
I just went to check this out and it seems to require a Google account which I don't have...
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 09-12-2011
Works for me without logging in
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - E300TSC - 09-12-2011
Do you have G-mail or any google related sign-in's? Maybe my youtube log in would work...
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Captain America - 09-13-2011
I do but not logged into it when I load the page. PM me your email address
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - E300TSC - 09-13-2011
For grins, I just typed in my usual forum password and it let me in. I must have set something up with Google in the past. Got the document now, thanks to OM616 for the time and effort put into this!
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Greazzer - 09-13-2011
HELP / INFO please
Will a pump from a 300GD work on the OM 617.952 engine. Also, I was told by the seller that the "M" Pump did not have an ALDA. Is that true. Below is the pump's info. Will this work for my 1985 300D Turbo ?
Please let me know. I am getting ready to buy myself an "M" pump finally.
Thanks in advance.
Data Plate:
PES5M55C320RS105
011 649 31193
0 400 075 999
617 070 1901 EPRO4
BOSCH
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - winmutt - 09-13-2011
300GD is almost certainly going to be om617.91x and would not have an alda. I would also imagine that the GD is tuned for torque. If you are planning on upgrading(rebuild and elements) this then you are gtg, otherwise pass.
Do you need a new pump?
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - Greazzer - 09-13-2011
Hey,
I am looking for a "M" Pump for a rebuild ... SUPER PERFORMANCE BUT also OK for everyday driver. So is this OK ? No ALDA ? So I guess I will be getting rid of some vacuum elements and lines. New Pump ? You have one for sale ? Thanks
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - cjcosta - 12-07-2011
Great doc. Thanks.
Maybe after reading it a few more times i get my hands on the IP.
RE: Bosch M and Mw pump theory - lpumb3 - 10-02-2012
awesome write up om616
, ill be re-reading it a few times . if i get most of the fine balance act of tuning it ill be happy .it seems like for every turn in or out you make you have to mirror/negative the adjustment on the other end of the spring , is the ALDA and shutoff valve the only pressure actuated fuel delivery function on these pumps? i have an auto so i have the trans functions . having trouble finding a good vacume thread on here, for tuning my tranny , before i start tinkering with pump etc ?