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+--- Thread: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread (/showthread.php?tid=1843)
my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - stan - 10-11-2010
so the '85 engine is now sitting in the back of my '80 TD and it's time to start planning, gathering parts, and getting things ready to go.
goals:
-freshen up engine before putting into use
-add a bit of engine performance if possible
-eliminate A/C system - all lines and the compressor itself
-mate the '85 heater hoses up to the '80 chassis so i can manually enable heater
-clean up engine bay and rattle can paint it
-polish and / or paint valve cover
-use aftermarket oil cooler, radiator, and transmission cooler, possibly relocate oil/trans coolers for optimum use
-
my reason for the aftermarket cooling implements is twofold. an aftermarket radiator will be cheaper, and also won't have the plastic end tanks which break. using an aftermarket transmission fluid cooler and oil cooler will allow me to use better-performing ones, and allow me to put them in more ideal locations. i commute from orange county to UCSB every weekend, and this involves several extended grades along the 101. i'd like to protect my oil and trans fluid from overheating to keep everything happy.
i have no need for the ac system, so i wish to go ahead and just eliminate the ac compressor, belt, hoses, condenser, etc. i'm not going to touch anything inside of the cabin, but i will remove all the extraneous bits in the engine compartment. this will free up some space for when i'm mucking around in there. the weight savings will be negligible for my purposes, so this is really just aesthetics.
i need to make sure i can hook up my '85 engine heater hoses to the '80 chassis heater core system - the '80 has the evil servo, which i plan to remove entirely. i will put ball valves in the lines so that i can go into the engine compartment and enable/disable flow to the heater core. the *very* rare times i need heat, this is fine for me.
i will also be putting a flat plate heat exchanger in-line on the heater lines so that my WVO can be run at proper temperature. my driving is mostly long freeway trips, so i will probably just mount a small (1 gal) diesel tank in the engine compartment for heating up before switching to WVO pumped from the stock fuel tank.
as far as cleaning up the engine bay - will probably hit the whole thing with degreaser, then wire brush it. then naval jelly, and rattle can paint it. i am not trying ot make it beautiful. mostly just want ot be able to see if i get leaks, and have it look a little less shitty. right now there is some screwed up paint, and areas of surface rust in there.
performance-wise, i'm not sure exactly what to do. i have been reading up on using GT2056V / GT2256V turbos, but with my stock IP i'm not sure if this will be a worthwhile mod. i will continue doing research, and also appreciate any advice you may have.
to freshen up the engine, i'm looking to just do whatever is feasible in the time period and budget i have - $600-1000, and about 2 months. i don't want to have everything rebuilt and machined etc. my thinking right now is to replace all gaskets - including head gasket. clean gunk from everything, replace / calibrate little bits. maybe build a pop tester (using the bottle jack method) and rebuild / calibrate my injectors. not looking to do a full rebuild as i have neither the time nor the money for it. i just want to do as much as i can to make sure i get plenty of use out fo the engine, and have it running nicely.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - garage - 10-11-2010
As far as all aftermarket cooling, i applaud you, i plan to do the exact same, its overall a smarter thing to do IMO.
For performance, how about taking the rack limiter out of the IP and adjusting the torque capsule? Rudolf showed me and Captain how to do it when we adjusted Captains IP, its not THAT difficult especially if the engine is gonna be on a stand, im pretty sure we could do it again. Id really like to do mine too.
How about porting the heads a bit?
A new cam?
I think a straight pipe makes quite a difference..
Setting up a baldwin fuel filter like Forced has is a great idea that i really wanna do too, especially for wvo.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - SicNick - 10-13-2010
" i commute from orange county to UCSB every weekend, and this involves several extended grades along the 101. i'd like to protect my oil and trans fluid from overheating "
with all due respect, those anthills are nothing to worry about, I spent my whole life in Southern Ca, and the only freeway grades worth noting are the grapevine, cajon pass, and Gaviota, just a ways north of UCSB.If it's nasty hills you want, come see Forced, myself, or one of the other CO members!
Also you can get a very simple heater control valve from Vatozone or whatever for less than $20. Manual or vacuum actuated.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - garage - 10-13-2010
(10-13-2010, 02:37 PM)SicNick " i commute from orange county to UCSB every weekend, and this involves several extended grades along the 101. i'd like to protect my oil and trans fluid from overheating "
If it's nasty hills you want, come see Forced, myself, or one of the other CO members!
Also you can get a very simple heater control valve from Vatozone or whatever for less than $20. Manual or vacuum actuated.
Theres some pretty gnarly hills round here.
Ive been in a benz up to 9,700 feet, running on straight WVO.
I dont think thats an anthill.
Theres some pretty high mountain roads around here in CA..i know CO has some high stuff i mean pikes peak is there, thats like 14,000.
But there is definetly some hills here that will put a hurt on the ol benz.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - 300D50 - 10-14-2010
Get the heater valve from a 90's yota pickup. They're vac driven so it fits the mercedes spirit of vac everything as well!
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - ForcedInduction - 10-14-2010
Swap in the manual HVAC system from a 240D. Nothing beats old-fashioned manual controls.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - garage - 10-14-2010
Stan, if you wanna swap in a manual climate control unit, i have 240 that i plan on ripping my AC and heater out of, last time i ripped all that junk out it wasnt too bad.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - stan - 10-14-2010
(10-14-2010, 09:59 AM)garage Stan, if you wanna swap in a manual climate control unit, i have 240 that i plan on ripping my AC and heater out of, last time i ripped all that junk out it wasnt too bad.
i was really fine with just not having a/c, but maybe we can see whats involved in the swap. gotta remember this is an evil servo car.
update on everything: got a friend to help me lift the engine out of the back of the wagon. shit is HEAVY. engine is now in my garage, waiting for my attention.
here's the parts that i am thinking should be replaced for sure:
-head gasket
-manifold gaskets
-oil pan gasket
-turbo-related gaskets
-oil cooler lines
-injector heat shields (because i plan on fiddling with the injectors
-glow plugs
is there more that would make sense to replace for good measure?
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - Oil Burner - 10-14-2010
I am doing a similar Task, My wife had a 80 300CD that she gave me with a destroyed engine and trans. I recieved a 84 300 SD from my aunt that her sons thrashed the exrerior and chassis.
The 84 engine and trans I have installed all new gaskets filters and soft lines plus I powder coated every part I could. The entire engine is Yellow and Chrome Powder.
Here is the power Mods I have done.
1. Removed the entire EGR system from the engine.
2. Blocked off all oil Breathers except on Valve cover to eliminate Oil in Intake.
3. Blocked off Valve on Turbo can not rember the Merc Name for it. Somthing like Over Speed Valve.
I too would like to know about taking the rack limiter out of the IP and adjusting the torque capsule anbody in Norther Cal know about this?
The problems I have ran into without even puting the engine is.
1. The steering lines will not work from the NTD to the TD model but i have those.
2. I am having the same problem with the HVAC and I think I will do what you are doing get rid of the AC and find a valve with a cable from the engine to the inside to turn on the heater core circulation.
3. The enormous Vacume diference between the 2 cars has been my bigest problem wish there was some kind of bible for the Mercedes Vacum system...anyone have something like this?
4. Throttle linkage needs to be adjusted just a little unless you got it from the other car, just getting them all to work together has been my issue..cruise control
Whe I get back to it in a few weeks I will throw in all my other problems too. Hope yours is going a little better.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - SicNick - 10-15-2010
(10-13-2010, 04:37 PM)garage [quote='SicNick' pid='19033' dateline='1286998672']
" i commute from orange county to UCSB every weekend, and this involves several extended grades along the 101. i'd like to protect my oil and trans fluid from overheating "
Theres some pretty gnarly hills round here.
Ive been in a benz up to 9,700 feet, running on straight WVO.
I dont think thats an anthill.
Theres some pretty high mountain roads around here in CA..i know CO has some high stuff i mean pikes peak is there, thats like 14,000.
But there is definetly some hills here that will put a hurt on the ol benz.
If you read what I ACTUALLY wrote, I was responding to specifically what the OP said... I lived there man, I know there is atleast one or two mountains in CA
it is funny however that CO has 53 or so 14ers, (mountains atleast 14,000 ft high) and CA only has one, Mt Whitney. BUT Whitney is taller than any mountain in CO!
(10-14-2010, 04:10 PM)Oil Burner I am doing a similar Task, My wife had a 80 300CD that she gave me with a destroyed engine and trans. I recieved a 84 300 SD from my aunt that her sons thrashed the exrerior and chassis.
The 84 engine and trans I have installed all new gaskets filters and soft lines plus I powder coated every part I could. The entire engine is Yellow and Chrome Powder.
Here is the power Mods I have done.
1. Removed the entire EGR system from the engine.
2. Blocked off all oil Breathers except on Valve cover to eliminate Oil in Intake.
3. Blocked off Valve on Turbo can not rember the Merc Name for it. Somthing like Over Speed Valve.
I too would like to know about taking the rack limiter out of the IP and adjusting the torque capsule anbody in Norther Cal know about this?
The problems I have ran into without even puting the engine is.
1. The steering lines will not work from the NTD to the TD model but i have those.
2. I am having the same problem with the HVAC and I think I will do what you are doing get rid of the AC and find a valve with a cable from the engine to the inside to turn on the heater core circulation.
3. The enormous Vacume diference between the 2 cars has been my bigest problem wish there was some kind of bible for the Mercedes Vacum system...anyone have something like this?
4. Throttle linkage needs to be adjusted just a little unless you got it from the other car, just getting them all to work together has been my issue..cruise control
Whe I get back to it in a few weeks I will throw in all my other problems too. Hope yours is going a little better.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - garage - 10-17-2010
So i cant respond on a public forum??
CA has 13 mountains over 14,000 feet, and we have 2mountains that are taller than any in CO..
Im sure most states have mountain roads that could put a hurt on the ol diesel. I never said CA was MORE gnarly than CO.
But yes imo when its mid summer and its 110degrees outside when your going up the Cajon, i think itd be a darn good idea to have larger/aftermarket cooling.
Stans already had enough fun on the Cajon...i think
haha
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - ForcedInduction - 10-17-2010
(10-15-2010, 10:15 PM)SicNick it is funny however that CO has 53 or so 14ers, (mountains atleast 14,000 ft high) and CA only has one, Mt Whitney. BUT Whitney is taller than any mountain in CO!Its only 241' higher and you can't drive to the summit like you can on two of Colorado's 14ers.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - garage - 10-17-2010
Im over it, i dont wanna hijack the thread anymore.
I wish i could move to CO or somewhere further, and am jealous of you guys, i dislike CA very much.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - ForcedInduction - 10-17-2010
(10-17-2010, 01:24 PM)garage i dislike CA very much.
I love CA, especially the coastal cities, just not the people running it.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - garage - 10-17-2010
(10-17-2010, 02:06 PM)ForcedInduction(10-17-2010, 01:24 PM)garage i dislike CA very much.
I love CA, especially the coastal cities, just not the people running it.
I mean weather wise its pretty great, and the fact that the beach, desert, mountains and what not are all so close together is awesome. Its just WAY too over populated IMO. Its all crowded and dirty everywhere.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - stan - 10-17-2010
i've been doing a little reading up on mild performance increases - what i've learned so far:
-water/methanol (washer fluid) injection right after the turbo compressor might be good
-a/w intercooler might be good
-gt2256v or gt2056v would be cool, but probably out of my budget (cheapest i can find online is $550)
-i can run more boost
i've gotta pull the oil cooler lines when i get home, going to need to get those sorted out so i can hook up an aftermarket oil cooler. also need to figure out what type of connectors the trans cooler lines have and whether i can find lines to mate up to those for an aftermarket trans fluid cooler.
i need to look into high temp coatings - i want to clean up the manifolds and turbo and make them not just go right back to rusty in a month.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - garage - 10-18-2010
(10-17-2010, 11:12 PM)stan i've been doing a little reading up on mild performance increases - what i've learned so far:
-water/methanol (washer fluid) injection right after the turbo compressor might be good
-a/w intercooler might be good
-gt2256v or gt2056v would be cool, but probably out of my budget (cheapest i can find online is $550)
-i can run more boost
i've gotta pull the oil cooler lines when i get home, going to need to get those sorted out so i can hook up an aftermarket oil cooler. also need to figure out what type of connectors the trans cooler lines have and whether i can find lines to mate up to those for an aftermarket trans fluid cooler.
i need to look into high temp coatings - i want to clean up the manifolds and turbo and make them not just go right back to rusty in a month.
I would say those are all good ideas, as long as you turn up the fuel too.
I coated my exhaust manifold in a whole can of flat black VHT paint from pepboys. Its holding up great so far and looks good.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - Oil Burner - 10-18-2010
(10-17-2010, 11:12 PM)stan i've been doing a little reading up on mild performance increases - what i've learned so far:
-water/methanol (washer fluid) injection right after the turbo compressor might be good
i need to look into high temp coatings - i want to clean up the manifolds and turbo and make them not just go right back to rusty in a month.
What have you heard on the Water/Methanol what are the actual HP and EGT improvments on the MB engine?
I have the luxary of having a blast cabinet at work. Everything that could be cleaned I used are Hot parts washer then blasted them with Glass amazing how nice they look that way, but powder coating is allot nicer and you can choose what color you want. I powder coated the intake and the induction side of the Turbo. The Exhaust side of the Manifold and the Turbo I got the Paint from eastwood.
(www.eastwood.com) has everything paint, blast cabinet and powder coating stuff from Eastwood I have had good luck with there exhaust paint on all my gas and diesel engines. 10 years still looks like new.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - 617.952 - 10-18-2010
you forgot a sniff of propane, just a sniff to help it all pop
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - Rudolf_Diesel - 10-18-2010
(10-17-2010, 11:12 PM)stan -gt2256v or gt2056v would be cool, but probably out of my budget (cheapest i can find online is $550)
I a 2256 in my garage, all it needs is a new compressor backing plate. I bought one from FI awhile back and was going to install on my car. I had to machine it slightly to make it work, but I ended up giving it to Deliveryvalve.
I will give you REALLY good deal on the turbo - you just have to buy the backing plate and send it to me so I can assemble the turbo. I ordered one a while back, but never picked it up - price was $25.00. Let me know if you are interested...
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - stan - 10-19-2010
doing more research, reading the IP adjustment thread (http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/ip-full-load-adjustment-procedure-for-mw-pumps-t-189.html)
with all possible MW pump mods done (the ones mentioned in the above thread), and water/methanol injection, will i be able to take advantage of a GT2256V? will i be able to push more boost with all that, or am i going to just be able to make the power sooner (due to VNT)? i'm still wrapping my head around all this and it would be cool to know if i'm on the right track here.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - garage - 10-19-2010
With a VNT/VGT turbo i belive you can be idleing and making boost.
I still dont know a whoollee lot about turbos but i think its a vacuum controlled turbo and its alot easier to set at what point on the RPM scale you want to start making boost.
RE: my '85 TD engine into an '80 TD swap thread - stan - 10-21-2010
anyone able to shed some light on my last few questions (above garage's post)?