we've seen photos of that white lifted 300CD, and blurg's (jurgen, the 300td.org guy) "saharagelber" 300TD. i spoke to jurgen himself who said his slightly elevated ride height was solely due to using mercedes "heavy duty" springs - the ones they sold for the african/etc markets. i absolutely cannot find these springs anywhere.

alternate idea's i've seen proposed, but never actually done:
w126 springs
shimming the stock springs
custom springs


anyone have some insight into what can be done or where to find the kind of springs i am searching for?

---

hell, just for fun, here's a photo of jurgen's car

I know that for the w201 chassis using 124 springs will get the vehicle lifted but im not sure what springs will fit in the 123 chassis.

You cant find the part number or the parts themselves?

Ive been thinking about buying new coils, and getting the thickest coil shims i can find to acheive a little lift.

(08-11-2010 03:41 AM)stan Wrote:  ....

w126 springs
..

W126 springs would only fit in the rear suspension. Fronts, the spring diameter is too wide to fit the upper and lower spring perch.




.

---

(08-11-2010 07:26 PM)garage Wrote:  Ive been thinking about buying new coils, and getting the thickest coil shims i can find to acheive a little lift.

Garage for the fronts, get 300D turbo springs that are 16mm thickness and have a blue paint mark at the bottom along with 3 nub pads. This It would give you a good lift for your 240D. Rears, look at w126 for the springs.

All fairly cheap at you local pick and pulls.



.

(08-11-2010 08:11 PM)DeliveryValve Wrote:  

(08-11-2010 03:41 AM)stan Wrote:  ....

w126 springs
..

W126 springs would only fit in the rear suspension. Fronts, the spring diameter is too wide to fit the upper and lower spring perch.




.

---

(08-11-2010 07:26 PM)garage Wrote:  Ive been thinking about buying new coils, and getting the thickest coil shims i can find to acheive a little lift.

Garage for the fronts, get 300D turbo springs that are 16mm thickness and have a blue paint mark at the bottom along with 3 nub pads. This It would give you a good lift for your 240D. Rears, look at w126 for the springs.

All fairly cheap at you local pick and pulls.



.

Good info DV!
The w126 rears are how much taller do you know?
Are they stiffer too??

(08-11-2010 09:11 AM)winmutt Wrote:  You cant find the part number or the parts themselves?

can't find either one. can you point me in the right direction?

(08-11-2010 08:48 PM)garage Wrote:  .
.

Good info DV!
The w126 rears are how much taller do you know?
Are they stiffer too??

Mercedes on the w123 offered a variety of spring options for front and rear, different wire diameter and unloaded length.

I believe your 240D may have one of the following rear springs.
123 324 06 04 Spring travel per 1000N load- 18.45, wire diameter - 15.95, unloaded spring length 359.
123 324 14 04 Spring travel – 18.45, wire diameter - 15.95, unloaded spring length 355.

In the w126 FSM, there is a formula on how Mercedes determine which springs to put on the w126.

They only offered two springs for non-SLS vehicles.
116 324 08 04 Spring travel – 16.6, wire diameter – 16.9, unloaded spring length 376.
116 324 11 04 Spring travel – 16.6, wire diameter – 16.9, unloaded spring length 367.


And 3 spring combos for SLS Vehicles.
115 324 27 04 Spring travel – 19.5, wire diameter – 15.9. unloaded spring length 353.
123 324 06 04 Spring travel – 18.45, wire diameter – 16. unloaded spring length 359.
123 324 36 04 Spring travel – 19.4, wire diameter – 16, unloaded spring length 371.


Off the top of my head I think, the 116 324 08 04 springs were available on SDLs and 560SDLs (usually but not always, again depends on options i.e sunroof electric windows, electric rear seats etc). 116 324 11 04 usually came on the 300SDs. Those are probably the two springs I'd use for more lift and greater stiffness. The other spring I would use is 123 324 36 04. It will give you a little more lift and softer ride then the other two, this spring also came standard on the 300D turbo. These combos with Spring Pad thickness will help also.



Good luck.

.

(08-12-2010 11:29 AM)DeliveryValve Wrote:  

(08-11-2010 08:48 PM)garage Wrote:  .
.

Good info DV!
The w126 rears are how much taller do you know?
Are they stiffer too??

Mercedes on the w123 offered a variety of spring options for front and rear, different wire diameter and unloaded length.

I believe your 240D may have one of the following rear springs.
123 324 06 04 Spring travel per 1000N load- 18.45, wire diameter - 15.95, unloaded spring length 359.
123 324 14 04 Spring travel – 18.45, wire diameter - 15.95, unloaded spring length 355.

In the w126 FSM, there is a formula on how Mercedes determine which springs to put on the w126.

They only offered two springs for non-SLS vehicles.
116 324 08 04 Spring travel – 16.6, wire diameter – 16.9, unloaded spring length 376.
116 324 11 04 Spring travel – 16.6, wire diameter – 16.9, unloaded spring length 367.


And 3 spring combos for SLS Vehicles.
115 324 27 04 Spring travel – 19.5, wire diameter – 15.9. unloaded spring length 353.
123 324 06 04 Spring travel – 18.45, wire diameter – 16. unloaded spring length 359.
123 324 36 04 Spring travel – 19.4, wire diameter – 16, unloaded spring length 371.


Off the top of my head I think, the 116 324 08 04 springs were available on SDLs and 560SDLs (usually but not always, again depends on options i.e sunroof electric windows, electric rear seats etc). 116 324 11 04 usually came on the 300SDs. Those are probably the two springs I'd use for more lift and greater stiffness. The other spring I would use is 123 324 36 04. It will give you a little more lift and softer ride then the other two, this spring also came standard on the 300D turbo. These combos with Spring Pad thickness will help also.



Good luck.

.

this is good info, but for someone like me (300D turbo, possibly getting 300TD) not quite enough. also, we know that mercedes offered heavy duty springs. how would i find the part numbers for those?

(08-12-2010 01:03 PM)stan Wrote:  ...
this is good info, but for someone like me (300D turbo, possibly getting 300TD) not quite enough. also, we know that mercedes offered heavy duty springs. how would i find the part numbers for those?

This is the information I have...

Most 300D turbos and TD turbos have front spring p/n 123 321 41 04 - travel per 1000N load- 18.4, wire diameter - 15.8, unloaded spring length 450.
and 123 321 36 04 - travel per 1000N load- 20.4, wire diameter - 15.41, unloaded spring length 453.

A stiffer front spring p/n that I see is 123 321 45 04 - travel per 1000N load- 17.1, wire diameter - 16.2, unloaded spring length 450.
Another unit as stiff but bit shorter is 123 321 26 04 - travel per 1000N load- 17.45, wire diameter - 16, unloaded spring length 442

Typical rear springs for the 300D is what I mentioned earlier 123 324 36 04. You can still use the w126 rear springs I mentioned to get your car up higher along with thicker spring pads.


Another options is contacting Lesjofors like GREASY_BEAST did.
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/sls-...t-457.html



.

.
.

so i got my TD - non turbo. what would happen if i swapped out the front springs and shocks for the ones from a 300D turbo? and what about the SLS rear - swapping the 300D turbo springs in?

(08-25-2010 07:47 PM)stan Wrote:  so i got my TD - non turbo. what would happen if i swapped out the front springs and shocks for the ones from a 300D turbo? and what about the SLS rear - swapping the 300D turbo springs in?

Im stoked on your wagon dude, it makes me wanna buy one!

For the rear, why not rip out the SLS, swap in the the longest springs from a w126/w123 that you can find, along with the thickest spring pads, and the bilstein HD shocks. I assume new springs would be better than junkyard springs too..

For the front, i think the longest w123 springs, a front suspension redo with all new bushings and what not, thickest spring pads and bilstein HDs.

I think for general offraod use, this is what would be the best/easiest route to go.
Its pretty much what i plan on doing.

Well I lowered mine and she does fine off road! You just gotta know how to drive.

Plus that Stan guy... IDK about him ... He's not the type to spend one penny on his car. lol

I think the 3 of us need to get our mercedes caravan offroad on some trails!

Sounds like a plan as long as there are no dead batteries, and cooling issues are solved....

haha
yeah i need a new radiator and battery/alternator

FML! Stan's list is growing right now. (im chatin with him on AIM) and so is mine!

The wagon is REAL fun on gravel roads

soon as i get my sls delete done i'm up for some trails! i should be able to jump start you girly men now with my 115 amps and 14.4 volts.

Umm sir, I will cut your car in half with my 1950 cranking amps...... What chu got on that??? lol

thats how much your battery can deliver to the starter, but your alternator is still a little baby 55 amps assuming its even in tip top condition, which judging by the rest of your car, it probably is not :-P

Which doesn't mean a damn thing. And its 65 not 55 im pretty sure it runs 14 volts all day long with the headlights and heater on. 14.2 in the daytime. Plus that alt will kill your motor. My shitball stock alternator draws down the turbo engine significantly when there is a heavy load on it. Even after running the GP's and cranking I have not seen the alt have to put out more than 25amps to recharge the batt. Maybe that's all it is capable of? haha

---

maybe I'll install another alt in place of the AC compressor and strap three tires to my roof with 20 gallons of fuel .... Chew on that!

(09-12-2010 03:32 PM)Captain America Wrote:  Umm sir, I will cut your car in half with my 1950 cranking amps...... What chu got on that??? lol

1700 COLD cranking amps and 2000 CA when I get the second battery installed for winter.

(09-12-2010 07:24 PM)ForcedInduction Wrote:  

(09-12-2010 03:32 PM)Captain America Wrote:  Umm sir, I will cut your car in half with my 1950 cranking amps...... What chu got on that??? lol

1700 COLD cranking amps and 2000 CA when I get the second battery installed for winter.

Oops! I made a mistake... 1750CCA ....

That's fine, while your hauling 90+lbs back there I will still be at 60 hehe

But really that's why I choose to buy this battery...

PC 1750 Design:

* Absorbent glass mat (AGM) technology
* 12V battery pure VRLA
* BCI group 65 battery
* Rugged construction
* Tin plated brass SAE terminals
* Can be mounted in any orientation. To meet group 65 specifications, battery must remain upright.
* Suitcase lifting handle
* US DOT and IATA certified non-spillable
* Shipped fully charged - just install and go
* Container and cover made from oil resistant plastic

Performance Features:

* PHCA: 1,750A at 80°F (27°C); for 5 seconds
* CCA: 930A at 0°F (-18°C)
* CA/MCA: 1,175A at 32° (0°C)
* HCA: 1,325 at 80°F (27°C)
* Reserve capacity: 135 minutes on 25amps
* Short circuit current: 5,000A
* Deep cycling capability: 400 at 80% DOD
* Design life: 12 years
* Typical service life: 6 to 8 years

Physical Characteristics:

Overall Dimensions: 11 13/16 x 7 1/4 x 7 7/16
Weight: 60 pounds
High rate discharge of 1750 amps for 5 seconds

because having two batteries is a lot of money and a lot of weight! This batt cost me $280. Its like an Optima on steroids.

(09-12-2010 01:35 PM)stan Wrote:  soon as i get my sls delete done i'm up for some trails!

Now thats the attitude!

(09-12-2010 11:11 PM)Captain America Wrote:  That's fine, while your hauling 90+lbs back there I will still be at 60 hehe

More rear weight = better snow traction.
My 240 is a cruiser/winter car so low weight isn't as important as weight distribution.

(09-12-2010 11:11 PM)Captain America Wrote:  Oops! I made a mistake... 1750CCA ....


This batt cost me $280. Its like an Optima on steroids.

Hey Captain what brand/model of battery is this? Where did you purchase it from?

(09-14-2010 08:41 PM)Silberpfeil Wrote:  

(09-12-2010 11:11 PM)Captain America Wrote:  Oops! I made a mistake... 1750CCA ....


This batt cost me $280. Its like an Optima on steroids.

Hey Captain what brand/model of battery is this? Where did you purchase it from?

It's an Odyssey That I bought form a place called West Coast Battery, Model PC 1750T

They have all types including the same one that is metal jacketed for use in the hot engine compartment.... that provides 1950 cranking amps!

http://www.odysseybatteries.com/battery/pc1750t.htm

---

(09-14-2010 06:34 PM)ForcedInduction Wrote:  

(09-12-2010 11:11 PM)Captain America Wrote:  That's fine, while your hauling 90+lbs back there I will still be at 60 hehe

More rear weight = better snow traction.
My 240 is a cruiser/winter car so low weight isn't as important as weight distribution.

Ahh so acceleration isn't really important anyway haha. Just make a circle of batteries in the spare tire well and provide a winch service to all the people that fall off the road in the snow lol

It's too bad you guys are in socal. It would be fun to be tow vehicle in the rough spots

(09-18-2010 11:27 AM)Syncro_G Wrote:  It's too bad you guys are in socal. It would be fun to be tow vehicle in the rough spots

Your only like 7 hours away if i drive WOT the whole way

But seriously, one of these days, all us Mercedes offroad enthusiasts should plan a multiday offroad trip somwhere. That would be TOO cool.
I would be 100% down for that, when Betsy's checklist is crossed off.

(09-18-2010 12:55 PM)garage Wrote:  But seriously, one of these days, all us Mercedes offroad enthusiasts should plan a multiday offroad trip somwhere. That would be TOO cool.
I would be 100% down for that, when Betsy's checklist is crossed off.

i'm about to put in a big fat 400 dollar order on partsgeek right now (radiator hoses, accumulators, sls fluid, glow plugs, etc), and picking up heavy duty rear springs in the next few days. after that i should be close to ready.

(09-18-2010 12:58 PM)stan Wrote:  

(09-18-2010 12:55 PM)garage Wrote:  But seriously, one of these days, all us Mercedes offroad enthusiasts should plan a multiday offroad trip somwhere. That would be TOO cool.
I would be 100% down for that, when Betsy's checklist is crossed off.

i'm about to put in a big fat 400 dollar order on partsgeek right now (radiator hoses, accumulators, sls fluid, glow plugs, etc), and picking up heavy duty rear springs in the next few days. after that i should be close to ready.

Niice, i need to do the same very soon.
She does pretty well offroad at the moment with 30year old parts, i just dont trust her on long offroad trips right now.
Cant wait till i get all new suspension components!!

yeah with the sls working (knock on wood) and heavy duty springs to boot, i think i should be in pretty good shape. fronts are giving me some trouble though, but that's a story for another thread.

I have my list down to 1,000,000 items... Shouldn't take too long

---

Ok so we'll go down to SD and run the rally race with the dude from Benz World and then go up to see Syncro and out wheel his over rated G wagon haha

(09-18-2010 02:08 PM)Captain America Wrote:  I have my list down to 1,000,000 items... Shouldn't take too long

---

Ok so we'll go down to SD and run the rally race with the dude from Benz World and then go up to see Syncro and out wheel his over rated G wagon haha

Yeah it seems as its never ending, but thats part of why i love my car.

DUDE! We need to enter some rally cross races! That would be way fun to compete with other Mercedes.
Maybe we can convince Syncro to sell his wagen, and join the super rad w123 club

hahah I just need that oil pan skid because the front of mine is already lower... After that I'm down!

Quote:Maybe we can convince Syncro to sell his wagen, and join the super rad w123 club

It would take a lot to pry the G from me but I am planning to get an older sedan for my wife. Just not sure yet what it is (definitely a Mercedes diesel)
My practical side is saying w123 while the emotional side is saying 2-door w111 or possibly a ponton. Rallying w123s sounds like a blast. If I wasn't busy with two toddlers, I'd jump on the idea.

I do love the G's!

oh man, peachparts tool rental guys want you to pay for the whole spring compressor tool while renting it....ugh. anyone in socal own one?

Well yeah. Its insurance that you will return it

this is off topic, but back towards the original topic.

Now, is there any advantage to simply blocking up the rear subframe, diff, and springs? Kind of like a body lift, not a suspension lift?

You would have to block up the diff on an angle, so the flex disc remained straight in relation to the driveshaft, but the end result would be to raise the whole body up, but keep the same suspension geometry. Thoughts?

That it would look weird?

I just finished installing a 1.25" lift on my truck. it's not a w123 but it made me think that there might be similar products in the w123 spring sizes.
I'm heading to Hollister this weekend for an overland rally and will test it out.

   

Well I just bought a '88 jeep cherokee, I think a 617 would fit in that thing great!

(09-24-2010 01:02 AM)Syncro_G Wrote:  I just finished installing a 1.25" lift on my truck. it's not a w123 but it made me think that there might be similar products in the w123 spring sizes.
I'm heading to Hollister this weekend for an overland rally and will test it out.

What is this overland rally you speak of?

---

(09-24-2010 01:16 AM)Captain America Wrote:  Well I just bought a '88 jeep cherokee, I think a 617 would fit in that thing great!

HELL YEAH!

---

(09-21-2010 12:25 PM)dropnosky Wrote:  this is off topic, but back towards the original topic.

Now, is there any advantage to simply blocking up the rear subframe, diff, and springs? Kind of like a body lift, not a suspension lift?

You would have to block up the diff on an angle, so the flex disc remained straight in relation to the driveshaft, but the end result would be to raise the whole body up, but keep the same suspension geometry. Thoughts?

Is there any purpose to a bodylift other than getting the actual body away from the ground, and gaining some fender clearance?
I dont see it helping in offroad scenerios..unless im gonna be doing rock crawling or somthing.

Idk, am i wrong?
It seems like in a rally application it would be worse for tge car allowing the body to roll more during turns.

(09-24-2010 09:14 AM)garage Wrote:  

(09-24-2010 01:02 AM)Syncro_G Wrote:  I just finished installing a 1.25" lift on my truck. it's not a w123 but it made me think that there might be similar products in the w123 spring sizes.
I'm heading to Hollister this weekend for an overland rally and will test it out.

What is this overland rally you speak of?

---

(09-24-2010 01:16 AM)Captain America Wrote:  Well I just bought a '88 jeep cherokee, I think a 617 would fit in that thing great!

HELL YEAH!

---

(09-21-2010 12:25 PM)dropnosky Wrote:  this is off topic, but back towards the original topic.

Now, is there any advantage to simply blocking up the rear subframe, diff, and springs? Kind of like a body lift, not a suspension lift?

You would have to block up the diff on an angle, so the flex disc remained straight in relation to the driveshaft, but the end result would be to raise the whole body up, but keep the same suspension geometry. Thoughts?

Is there any purpose to a bodylift other than getting the actual body away from the ground, and gaining some fender clearance?
I dont see it helping in offroad scenerios..unless im gonna be doing rock crawling or somthing.

Idk, am i wrong?
It seems like in a rally application it would be worse for tge car allowing the body to roll more during turns.

Well in any type of performance application the goal is to keep CG as low as possible. In an offroad app. It is to keep CG low and put the biggest tire underneath the vehicle. The only benefit I see to a body lift is to gain tire to body clearance to allow for more suspension travel. As Garage stated I think the raised CG would be bad. In these cars I guess the question is, what lift is easier? body or suspension?

(09-24-2010 09:14 AM)garage Wrote:  What is this overland rally you speak of?

https://www.expeditionswest.com/store/pr...t=0&page=1

Im just going for saturday -- there's going to be a big G-wagen turnout.

(09-24-2010 02:24 PM)Syncro_G Wrote:  

(09-24-2010 09:14 AM)garage Wrote:  What is this overland rally you speak of?

https://www.expeditionswest.com/store/pr...t=0&page=1

Im just going for saturday -- there's going to be a big G-wagen turnout.

Oh that seems cool, make sure to take some pics!

Sorry, I didn't take that many pictures. Overall, it was a blast but too quick for an overnighter.

Here's a bunch of guys planning to upright an overturned VW Syncro that's on a 40 deg slope.
   

A bunch of fellow G-wagen guys at the top of one of the local peaks during an evening trail run
   

same trail run - found a tarantula making it's way across the road. Had to stop and get a close look
   

Howd your wagen do on the trails? How many miles of trails were covered? Were the trails pretty gnarly?