I have been working on adapting a Tremec TKO 500 transmission to my OMG617 Super Turbo Diesel. The trans will be upgraded to handle up to 750 lb/ft of torque and if I go with the TKO 600, it could be upgraded to handle 900 lb/ft. I have considered the T5, but it does not provide as many options as the TKO, though cost is very temping. The T5 can be upgraded to handle 500 lb/ft, but that costs as much as a TKO 500 with upgardes.

One of the challenges is adapting the trans to the motor - New motor plate with Ford/Tremec bell housing or a Mercedes bell housing with an adapter plate to Tremec; I chose the latter. I found a bell housing from an iron 4-speed and have an adapter plate in the works.

The next step is the flywheel, I have been going nucking futs looking for the solution - M110, 240D, 300D, G-wagen, Ford, or custom. M110 has a bigger clutch, but too light; 240D is available, but on the light side; 300D correct size and weight, but almost impossible to get; G-wagen has larger clutch, but I have not pursued as an option. Ford, size may be prohibitive due to bell housing; and Custom - cost is too much.

I called Mercedes dealer and both the 300D and G-wagen flywheels are still available new, $750.00 and $650.00 respectively. I do not want to spend that much if I can help it. I know the trans is going to cost, but if I can keep the rest down it will be more appealing.

Yesterday I scored and found a 300D flywheel! I was browsing ebay and found an M-pump with the description of a 300D with a 4-speed transmission. I emailed the wrecking yard to see if they had the flywheel and he said he did. Now I have search on one of these "parts" sites where wrecking yards email you and tell you they have the part, most have tried to sell me an automatic flex plate assembly for up to $350.00. I asked him the price and he quoted $125.00, I went down there and it was exactly what I have been searching for!!!

   

It has some rust, but nothing to be concerned about, it will clean up well and let me get some sleep at nght - one less part to search for.

To be continued....

YES!! Another thread for me to drool over! I'll be following this one as well as your supercharger progress!

"my OMG617 Super Turbo Diesel" Hahaha!

Are you going to be running the stock trans with the supercharger while you work on this project? I've been curious about that. If so, I'm also curious about how long it will last behind the amount of power your engine will be putting out!

Subscribed for the goodness to follow.

are you aware that it you search "EM9D" on google, your project is number 5 after a bunch of phones?

So am I correct in that flywheel is just taller in comparison to a 240 flywheel as the biggest difference? all the weight is in the extra thickness of the ring beyond the friction surface? What a score!

(06-30-2010 08:18 PM)dropnosky Wrote:  are you aware that it you search "EM9D" on google, your project is number 5 after a bunch of phones?

So am I correct in that flywheel is just taller in comparison to a 240 flywheel as the biggest difference? all the weight is in the extra thickness of the ring beyond the friction surface? What a score!

That's pretty cool!

According to a tecnical drawing I have and what I have seen and read on the web, you are correct. The 300D uses a 215 or 8-1/2" clutch disc and I think it has a 1-1/8" x 10 spline shaft. The G-wagon flywheel from what I can see is basically the 300D flywheel machined to fit a 9" clutch disc. I think I may go this route and machine the flywheel to accept a 9" disc and pressure plate for a Mercury Cougar from CenterForce. If I go that route I can use their dual friction clutch and centifugal weight design for more clamping pressure.

I couldn't believe it when I walked in the shop and saw that huge chunk of steel I cleaned up most of the surface rust, looks like it was sitting outside, and there are no major pits or damage. The clutch surface looks new and the ring gear looks like it has never seen a starter motor. I am soaking it in a citric acid bath and will take some pics when it is nice and clean.

I machined a stub shaft and need to drill and tap some holes so I can mount the flywheel and do some machine work to accept the bigger clutch.

If anyone has any other ideas for a clutch/pressure plate I am open to suggestions..

Nice score. Ebay AND local!

I finished drilling and tapping the holes on the stub shaft, FYI, the thread is M10x1,00. I checked the specs on the flywheel and they are right on the money, as I thought I think it was new or hardly used at all.

After a nice citric acid and water bath for about 4 hours, the rust came off without a fight.

I did some research on clutches and pressure plates and still nothing firm yet. I called CenterForce because they advertise that can build you a custom assembly, but I was told they are too busy to even consider.
More research until I come up with a winning combination.

I am considering selling the flywheel and then buying a G-wagen wheel, but that remains to be seen. BTW I weighed the flywheel and it weighs 36lbs. 9ozs.

Here are somes pics:

   
Nice and clean
   
So nice and pretty
   
Bolted to stub shaft
   
Stub Shaft
   
On the lathe checking for runout and trueness

That is either a big ass lathe or a small flywheel lol.

where are you in Cali Rudolf? Can I stop by to work on my getting closer to Super Turbo Diesel?

(07-02-2010 09:32 AM)Captain America Wrote:  That is either a big ass lathe or a small flywheel lol.

where are you in Cali Rudolf? Can I stop by to work on my getting closer to Super Turbo Diesel?

It is a BIG ASS lathe!

I live in the San Gabriel Valley, I used to live in the IE.

Man what I would do with some tools like that! I hate you... I used to have a pretty awesome shop to do all my work in... Did all the work on my GMC Sprint there before I picked up the Benz aka - tank

San Gabriel is on my way home from work in LA, well kinda haha.

That facility is at your work or home? What do ya do for work?

I'm guessing machinist?

That's where I'd put my money...

Or just some regular guy that happens to be good at machining like myself...

Hey Rudolf, I have a CNC machine that I have not used in months... I'd like to fire her up, you need anything?

(07-02-2010 11:15 AM)Captain America Wrote:  That's where I'd put my money...

Or just some regular guy that happens to be good at machining like myself...

Hey Rudolf, I have a CNC machine that I have not used in months... I'd like to fire her up, you need anything?

You are closer than you think...I was on TV once, if that helps

A new game...Guess What Rudolf Does

I was on TV a couple times... Overhaulin' and American Hot rod.

And in all the Muscle car magazines... Hot rod, Popular Hot Rodding, Muscle Car, Drive!, Lowrider, Muscle Car Power, Street Machine, Super Chevy, and World of Rods.

Ok Rudolf, this is fun haha what show were you on?, you gotta give us a lil hint! Did it have to do with Skunkwerks?

(07-02-2010 01:01 PM)Captain America Wrote:  I was on TV a couple times... Overhaulin' and American Hot rod.

And in all the Muscle car magazines... Hot rod, Popular Hot Rodding, Muscle Car, Drive!, Lowrider, Muscle Car Power, Street Machine, Super Chevy, and World of Rods.

Ok Rudolf, this is fun haha what show were you on?, you gotta give us a lil hint! Did it have to do with Skunkwerks?

Your TV and Media Resume far exceeds mine, YOU need a SAG card!

I was on Monster House - one of the last episodes about the Compton Sherrif's Dept. I was the welder, apparantly welding aluminum moves you to the top of the list. I was this close to being on Monster Garage (holds thumb and fore finger 5 mm apart), I applied and got a call back, but I guess they didn't like my pic. For Monster House I applied and a week later I was on the show. There were hundreds of applicants as welders/fabricators, but non could weld aluminum.

What the hell is a SAG card?

Nice! I want to learn aluminum myself so I can weld up my own stuff but its kinda hard without a machine.... man, I loved monster garage, too bad they didn't pick ya... maybe you could do the aluminum welding for me since your close


Don't think they expected the mohawk lol

   

SAG = Screen Actors Guild

We can trade, your CNC works for aluminum welding...

Thats a Deal!

I have the clutch and pressure plate sorted out...and it does not require any machine work on the flywheel. I went to a place called Clutchnet.com - they happen to be only a few miles from home and talked to one of the guys there. He told me to buy a pressure plate, 240D/300D and he will modify it to a greater pressure holding capacity. They will also build my clutch to match excatly what I need for the proper fitment of the trans/clutch/pressure plate. This will save a lot of headaches and will only cost around $345.00 not including a new pressure plate provided by me, around $88.00 from partsgeek.com

This is not going to be a "cheap" venture, but hopefully it will inspire a few to do the same or similar!

I had just found partsgeek and ordered some parts Thursday morn and they arrived at my house Friday with ground shipping... cant beat that!

I would really like to come see your car someday....

(07-04-2010 03:43 AM)Captain America Wrote:  I had just found partsgeek and ordered some parts Thursday morn and they arrived at my house Friday with ground shipping... cant beat that!

I would really like to come see your car someday....

Partsgeek is awesome because they drop ship from So. Cal and we get next day for ground!

As I get closer I will let you know and you can come by...

Man, you don't need a machine to weld aluminum, just MG-400 sticks and an oxy-acetylene torch.. That's how I do all my aluminum welding, steel is usually coat hangers, RG-45, or RG-60 if it really needs it. Granted, I'm a "hobbyist" and no professional, but if you want to weld everything, get a torch set. You can get into a full setup for about $300, tanks and all. I just built an entire 3" exhaust system using oxy-acetylene only.

[\soapbox]

Rudolf, this is one HELL of a project. Best thread(s) ever.

(07-04-2010 09:29 AM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  

(07-04-2010 03:43 AM)Captain America Wrote:  I had just found partsgeek and ordered some parts Thursday morn and they arrived at my house Friday with ground shipping... cant beat that!

I would really like to come see your car someday....

Partsgeek is awesome because they drop ship from So. Cal and we get next day for ground!

As I get closer I will let you know and you can come by...

Yeah, Guess they have a warehouse in Vernon...

I can't wait to come check it out!

---

(07-04-2010 10:43 AM)GREASY_BEAST Wrote:  Man, you don't need a machine to weld aluminum, just MG-400 sticks and an oxy-acetylene torch.. That's how I do all my aluminum welding, steel is usually coat hangers, RG-45, or RG-60 if it really needs it. Granted, I'm a "hobbyist" and no professional, but if you want to weld everything, get a torch set. You can get into a full setup for about $300, tanks and all. I just built an entire 3" exhaust system using oxy-acetylene only.

[\soapbox]

Rudolf, this is one HELL of a project. Best thread(s) ever.

You have any pics of your work?

I have doing some research and have assembled a 30 page report on the project, I have been crunching some numbers - dollars and gear ratios.

I have the opportunity to get a good deal, thanks to Captain America, on a Tremec TKO600. The only caveat is that the OD gear is .64, but this will be dealt with by changing the ring and pinion. My target is a 3.92 from a 200D/220D and my second choice is a 3.69 from a 240D.

I made a few calls and was quoted $250.00 for a 3.92, but being the cheap bastard I am, I went to a few of the local wrecking yards and found a 240D and got a 3.69.

Now I know what you are saying, "that gear ratio is way too low and your going to max out the RPMs real quick..."

The gear ratios for the Tremec are 1-2.87, 2-1.89, 3-1.28, 4-1.00, 5-.64 with these ratios and a 3.69 R&P, the car will turn 2005 RPM @ 65 mph, 2160 RPM @ 70, 2314 RPM @ 75 (my fwy cruising speed), 2468 RPM @ 80, 2623 RPM @ 85, 2777 RPM @ 90, 2931 RPM @ 95...

I want to get the 3.92, but for now I will try the 3.69 and see how it goes. With the 3.69 and in 5th gear the motor will be running in the range that has the motor at its' most efficient use of fuel...if I read the SAE report correctly.

Hey Rudolf, Lemme know when you are ready to take those measurements, I'll go grab the trans, and we'll meet up.

(07-22-2010 11:36 PM)Captain America Wrote:  Hey Rudolf, Lemme know when you are ready to take those measurements, I'll go grab the trans, and we'll meet up.

That sounds good, I am pretty busy next week, but the week after would be good. I will keep in touch.

*****************************************************

I forgot to ask, if anyone has a 3.92 diff that they want to sell, I am in the market. Thanks.

Speaking about diffs.... Are you going with a locker (I use that term loosely), rather a limited slip?

(07-23-2010 10:01 AM)Captain America Wrote:  Speaking about diffs.... Are you going with a locker (I use that term loosely), rather a limited slip?

I am looking at the piece that JTY is using, a "Phantom Grip" sometimes referred to as a "phantom slip" or "random grip" from the research I have been doing. I have even contemplated a Lincoln Locker, I do it a little differently. I weld the gaps in the side gears that do not contact the spider gears. I have not had one fail, I know others just weld the crap outof everything in there.

very interesting! nice project you got there!

Ill be using a nissan FS5R30A behind my om606 when I finally get moving on it. Of course, its going into a nissan (well, datsun) car, so itll be a little easier for me, HA ha! These transmissions hold over 600rwhp in daily driven 300ZX TTs and equal if not more torque.

its got an OD ratio of .711 and I can get easily swappable rear in 200mm ring gear flavors of 3.13, 3.357, 3.54 and 3.7 and 230mm ring gear ratios of 2.94 and 3.35 flavors, so I kind of lucked out here, lol! the R200s will hold right around 600 to 650 ft lbs with slicks, and the R230s will hold pretty much what ever you can throw at it.

all I need is an adapter plate, which I will make on my own and a sprinter van flywheel with a 300ZX clutch disk. (both are 240mm, so it makes it easy!)

the clutch and flywheel will be the most expensive part of my swap, since the trans go between $200 and $500 all day long.

(07-01-2010 08:06 PM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  I am considering selling the flywheel and then buying a G-wagen wheel, but that remains to be seen. BTW I weighed the flywheel and it weighs 36lbs. 9ozs.

I have a flywheel that supposedly came out of a G that I had shipped in from Germany(with matching clutch, throwout, etc). It was also pretty rusty when I got it but didnt appear to have and pits or severely worn grip surface. Anyway, since your beast will likely be putting more power down than mine ever will, I'm open for a trade, if you decide there is a serious performance/longevity gain to be had. I'll try to weigh it and see if theres any difference than what you posted for yours and post a couple of pics. I'm relatively local(S.D.) and I head up to visit my parents in the So.Bay ever month or so (in fact that's where the flywheel is currently, so I'll have to get my dad to weigh it). Alternately you can probably cruise by to take a look at it sometime as he's retired and usually around. Anyway, lemme know.

Josh

(07-24-2010 11:07 PM)SurfRodder Wrote:  

(07-01-2010 08:06 PM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  I am considering selling the flywheel and then buying a G-wagen wheel, but that remains to be seen. BTW I weighed the flywheel and it weighs 36lbs. 9ozs.

I have a flywheel that supposedly came out of a G that I had shipped in from Germany(with matching clutch, throwout, etc). It was also pretty rusty when I got it but didnt appear to have and pits or severely worn grip surface. Anyway, since your beast will likely be putting more power down than mine ever will, I'm open for a trade, if you decide there is a serious performance/longevity gain to be had. I'll try to weigh it and see if theres any difference than what you posted for yours and post a couple of pics. I'm relatively local(S.D.) and I head up to visit my parents in the So.Bay ever month or so (in fact that's where the flywheel is currently, so I'll have to get my dad to weigh it). Alternately you can probably cruise by to take a look at it sometime as he's retired and usually around. Anyway, lemme know.

Josh

Let me think about that for awhile...The G-wagen does have a larger clutch, 230 v. 215 for the 300D, which is quite a bit in the world of clutches: idea: I think a 190 clutch is the same size as well, so it might be an idea. Can you post a pic?

On another note, Our good buddy Deliveryvalve has sourced a 3.92 diff for me! That will put me right where I want to be.

Anyone want to buy a good 240D diff, it has been cleaned, inspected and painted - 3.69 R&P

(07-28-2010 07:41 AM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  On another note, Our good buddy Deliveryvalve has sourced a 3.92 diff for me! That will put me right where I want to be.

Im starting to think that Deliveryvalve either owns a yard, lives in a yard, or lives next to a yard. He found me a specific diff as well. I feel like he falls out his back door into a mountain of parts.

(07-28-2010 12:47 PM)dropnosky Wrote:  

(07-28-2010 07:41 AM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  On another note, Our good buddy Deliveryvalve has sourced a 3.92 diff for me! That will put me right where I want to be.

Im starting to think that Deliveryvalve either owns a yard, lives in a yard, or lives next to a yard. He found me a specific diff as well. I feel like he falls out his back door into a mountain of parts.

LOL

(07-28-2010 12:58 PM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  

(07-28-2010 12:47 PM)dropnosky Wrote:  

(07-28-2010 07:41 AM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  On another note, Our good buddy Deliveryvalve has sourced a 3.92 diff for me! That will put me right where I want to be.

Im starting to think that Deliveryvalve either owns a yard, lives in a yard, or lives next to a yard. He found me a specific diff as well. I feel like he falls out his back door into a mountain of parts.

LOL

HA!... That would be cool if my wife allowed such a thing!




Getting back to the scheduled programming...

Oh, What do we have here?... From a 1970 220D...

   

Close up..

   


It's a 3.92!!



Never seen this before, but the 3.92 has a baffle on the back side of the cover (shown on the right) unlike the later models (on left). Maybe the earlier type gear oil churned and foamed up too much?

   


R_D, A nice polished cover like this, along with your "Rudolf_Diesel" locker unit should finish this diff up nicely.

   






.

SEXY

The oil and the inside look really clean and the teeth look excellent. Thanks a million!

I talked to someone on that LSD and they said to run away, run awy fast! Have to look for some thing else I guess.

(07-28-2010 04:04 PM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  ...
I talked to someone on that LSD and they said to run away, run awy fast! Have to look for some thing else I guess.

Well that is a bummer... I'd offer up my 2.47 LSD carrier, but unfortunately it's limited to a few other ratios that is not what your looking for...



.

(07-28-2010 07:04 PM)DeliveryValve Wrote:  Well that is a bummer... I'd offer up my 2.47 LSD carrier, but unfortunately it's limited to a few other ratios that is not what your looking for...

Thanks anyway, I am going to contact a few companys that make the locker inserts and see what they might have to offer. I might even see if I could make some kind of a hybrid.

(07-28-2010 07:41 AM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  Can you post a pic?

yeah, Ill give my pappy a call and see what he can drum up...I think I even left some citric acid up there so he can cook the rust off first... how much did you use to clean off the one you have?

(07-29-2010 12:04 AM)SurfRodder Wrote:  

(07-28-2010 07:41 AM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  Can you post a pic?

yeah, Ill give my pappy a call and see what he can drum up...I think I even left some citric acid up there so he can cook the rust off first... how much did you use to clean off the one you have?

I used about 2 lbs. to 2 gallons of water, pretty strong but it does the job.

(07-28-2010 07:04 PM)DeliveryValve Wrote:  

(07-28-2010 04:04 PM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  ...
I talked to someone on that LSD and they said to run away, run awy fast! Have to look for some thing else I guess.

Well that is a bummer... I'd offer up my 2.47 LSD carrier, but unfortunately it's limited to a few other ratios that is not what your looking for...



.

I'm interested if it'll go in a 85 300D.

(08-06-2010 10:36 PM)85-300Dt Wrote:  

(07-28-2010 07:04 PM)DeliveryValve Wrote:  

(07-28-2010 04:04 PM)Rudolf_Diesel Wrote:  ...
I talked to someone on that LSD and they said to run away, run awy fast! Have to look for some thing else I guess.

Well that is a bummer... I'd offer up my 2.47 LSD carrier, but unfortunately it's limited to a few other ratios that is not what your looking for...



.

I'm interested if it'll go in a 85 300D.

It's in a 2nd Gen w126 case. You could transfer it to a 1st Gen case with a bunch of work.

Here are pictures.

http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/junk...l#pid14300



.

I have a clutch/flywheel question.

I have been looking at using a 240D flywheel,pressure plate,and bell housing to adapt a M5R2 5 speed to a OM617.Should I try to source a 300D or Gwagen flywheel and pressure plate?Should I re-machine the 300D/G flywheel for the M5R2 pressure plate and clutch disc?11 inch clutch came in the Super Coupe Thunder Birds with a M5R2.It has a 10 spline 1 and 1/16 inch input shaft.Is there anything smaller that would work with that shaft size and spline count?

EDIT

Ahhhhh shat!I forgot that the M5R2 has a one piece case.It's the T-45 and T56 that I was looking into.I guess I could skip the 240D bell housing and fab up an adapter plate.Still need ideas on the flywheel and clutch set up.The T-45 uses the same clutch as the M5R2.The T56 uses a 26 spline input shaft and 11 inch clutch.That's all the info I can find on it.

Whenever I do a project like this I try to use as few custom parts as possible. That gives you the ability to get your replacement parts as easy as possible.

As far as the clutch spline arrangement, I would talk to the guys at Clutchnet - they can build you any configuration you need for your application.

From what I have read, in the clutch world size matters - any increase in size, as small as it may be, exponentionally increase gripping capabilities on the clutch/pressure plate assembly.

If you get a G wagon flywheel I would leave it alone and have a clutch/plate assembly made for it from clutchnet and call it a day.

If you can use a Merecedes bell housing then it makes it easier, if you cannot source one, no big deal - just makes it slightly more difficult, but not impossible.

I am trying not to use any custom one off parts.If I break down,I wanna be able to go to any auto parts store and purchase what I need.It will make it way easier in the long run.

(09-25-2010 11:54 AM)ben2go Wrote:  I am trying not to use any custom one off parts.If I break down,I wanna be able to go to any auto parts store and purchase what I need.It will make it way easier in the long run.

If you are refering to the clutch I understand what you mean, but they may be able to tell you what cross references you can use - I think the 190 gasser clutches will work.