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Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
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erling66 Offline
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Post: #1
Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
Hi I have only room for a 4 cylinder engine in my car, so what will be the best turbo diesel engine? I mean most reliable and horsepower potential?
Maybe Toyota 3.0td or Isuzu 3.1td with mechanical diesel pump?
Thanks
09-12-2010 05:17 AM
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ForcedInduction Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
The 2.2L CDI is a very good option if you aren't put off by computers.

The Detroit Diesel Series 50 is another good option. 8.5L, 1,150ft/lb torque and 320hp of fun! Big Grin
[Image: P7170001.JPG]
09-12-2010 09:51 AM
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erling66 Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
Thanks for nice photo of a great engine but I think it will be a little heavy in my Toyota van.
Well I am old school so I like diesels that can run without electricity. Any other suggestions?
09-12-2010 02:01 PM
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Biohazard Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
(09-12-2010 02:01 PM)erling66 Wrote:  Well I am old school so I like diesels that can run without electricity. Any other suggestions?


Dang, that eliminates the VM 2.8 from the Jeep Liberty that was going to be my vote.

82 300SD aka The Flyin Pumpkin: 7.5mm super M-pump, T3 60 trim turbo, Coldish air intake, A/W intercooler, propane injection, cut springs all around, SW Boost and EGT gauges, Monark 265 nozzles, 16" late model wheels, ported/polished cylinder head, custom reground camshaft, electric fan. In the works: constant tinkering, engine swap to 84 Euro 300D

84 Euro 300D 4 sp: White with black trunk and hood. Blue cloth interior. Manual everything. Soon to get the Flyin Pumpkins engine! Big Grin
09-12-2010 04:37 PM
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Jtn190D Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
I would think over there you guys should have plenty of small diesel's?
09-12-2010 05:02 PM
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ForcedInduction Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
1.6 VW and 2.4L MB are the only small mechanical engines we got in significant numbers. There were a few Toyota/Nissan/Mazda/Isuzu engines, but they're rare.
(This post was last modified: 09-12-2010 07:42 PM by ForcedInduction.)
09-12-2010 07:41 PM
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willbhere4u Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
Evan Toyota never imported diesel over here to the US we only get 2nd hand imported ones from other country's

1987 300SDL 6spd manual om606.962 work in progress
1985 300td euro 5spd wagon 5cyl 5spd
1964 220S Heckflosse 4spd column shift
(This post was last modified: 09-12-2010 08:06 PM by willbhere4u.)
09-12-2010 08:06 PM
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ForcedInduction Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
(09-12-2010 08:06 PM)willbhere4u Wrote:  Evan Toyota never imported diesel over here to the US

Sure they did. I just saw one in Idaho Springs at the Phoenix Gold Mine.


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09-12-2010 08:15 PM
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erling66 Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
First reply to Biohazard: I heard that all the VM(Italian) diesel engines in Jeep/Plymouth are junk?

Well here in Europe we have a lot of Diesel engines in the junkyards, but it is very unusual to tune them for more horsepower(only some Finish guys that no one understands)
Maybe it is a good idea to fill up a container with good used engines and bring them to USA?Smile and put in some manual transmissions ad well.
09-13-2010 04:03 AM
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willbhere4u Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
Its an import I have worked on them at the Toyota shop in Berthoud Co the dealers never sold them here! But people brought them in from Canada

You have to get the parts sent over from Japan through the dealer it's a nightmare because the US dealers know anything about them and usually order the wrong parts!

meanwhile you don't find out till months later when they arrive! Took us almost a year to get all of the parts to rebuild a 2L 4cyl non turbo diesel

That's the Toyota 2L diesel in your pic forced but ours had a turbo kit made for it hence the engine rebuild it melted the pistons!

1987 300SDL 6spd manual om606.962 work in progress
1985 300td euro 5spd wagon 5cyl 5spd
1964 220S Heckflosse 4spd column shift
(This post was last modified: 09-13-2010 04:28 PM by willbhere4u.)
09-13-2010 04:26 PM
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Biohazard Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
The biggest thing I've heard on the VM 2.8 CRD is the intakes plugging up with carbon from the egr or pcv system. But, the VW TDI was also pretty well known for that also. It's a bit of labor, but not too expensive in parts (at least the VW wasn't) to pull the intake & egr and clean them; I want to say it used to be about 40 bucks in parts and about 500-600 in labor! My brother used to have the Liberty with the 2.8 CRD, it was a blast to drive. It had tons of torque for how small it was! The engine is all aluminum, too... Smile

82 300SD aka The Flyin Pumpkin: 7.5mm super M-pump, T3 60 trim turbo, Coldish air intake, A/W intercooler, propane injection, cut springs all around, SW Boost and EGT gauges, Monark 265 nozzles, 16" late model wheels, ported/polished cylinder head, custom reground camshaft, electric fan. In the works: constant tinkering, engine swap to 84 Euro 300D

84 Euro 300D 4 sp: White with black trunk and hood. Blue cloth interior. Manual everything. Soon to get the Flyin Pumpkins engine! Big Grin
09-13-2010 08:03 PM
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ForcedInduction Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
Many say the VM engine really benefits from a lower stall TC to take advantage of the engine's natural low RPM torque.
09-14-2010 05:12 AM
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erling66 Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
Maybe I should try to make room for a 6 cyl Mercedes. Take a look at this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24afjVqm2...r_embedded
09-14-2010 03:30 PM
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appie Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
How about a 5 banger? With the radiator mounted on the side,like the old audi's.
09-30-2010 03:02 PM
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MikeJRA Offline
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Post: #15
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
I just noticed how old this thread is but thought I should add, the VW 1.9 TD is great engine once you fix the crank nose, a known issue. There are some that have also put mechanical pumps on early 1.9 TDI's.

Bike Mike
(This post was last modified: 11-18-2010 03:56 PM by MikeJRA.)
11-18-2010 12:53 PM
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ben2go Offline
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Post: #16
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
(11-18-2010 12:53 PM)MikeJRA Wrote:  I just noticed how old this thread is but thought I should add, the VW 1.9 TD is great engine once you fix the crank nose, a known issue. There are some that have also put mechanical pumps on early 1.9 TDI's.

Yep.I really dig the 1.9TD.What's the issue with the crank snout?I'm thinking of dropping one in my Tracer Wagon.


There's a guy on http://www.boatdesign.net that converted a couple 1.9TDIs to marine engines.He didn't use many marine parts either.He DIY'ed on the cheap. http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/diy-mar...19118.html

1990 Mercury Blue Max Cougar 3.8L with Automatic
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11-18-2010 10:04 PM
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MikeJRA Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
That boat conversion looks cool.

The issue is with the AAZ 1.9TD crank nose. Over time the pulley on the crank will loosen off, start to wobble and then start to walk off the crank. When this happens the timing goes and WAMO, catastrophic failure. This problem seems to be caused by back forces from the alternator and the extra power of the 1.9, it's also caused by people not using new crank bolts when the timing belt is replaced. The accepted solution is to machine the cranknose to accept a 1.9TDI crank and install the TDI's clutched alternator pulley. The 1.9TDI's do not suffer this problem. http://www.vwdiesel.net has many threads on this.

My new to me 1.9TD Golf just started to do the death crank wobble.

Bike Mike
11-19-2010 12:20 AM
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ben2go Offline
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Post: #18
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
(11-19-2010 12:20 AM)MikeJRA Wrote:  That boat conversion looks cool.

The issue is with the AAZ 1.9TD crank nose. Over time the pulley on the crank will loosen off, start to wobble and then start to walk off the crank. When this happens the timing goes and WAMO, catastrophic failure. This problem seems to be caused by back forces from the alternator and the extra power of the 1.9, it's also caused by people not using new crank bolts when the timing belt is replaced. The accepted solution is to machine the cranknose to accept a 1.9TDI crank and install the TDI's clutched alternator pulley. The 1.9TDI's do not suffer this problem. http://www.vwdiesel.net has many threads on this.

My new to me 1.9TD Golf just started to do the death crank wobble.

Thanks for that piece of info.

1990 Mercury Blue Max Cougar 3.8L with Automatic
Future OM617 Super Turbo Diesel Conversion with T56 6 Speed Manual
11-19-2010 07:42 AM
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AMCtilldeath Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
(09-13-2010 04:26 PM)willbhere4u Wrote:  Its an import I have worked on them at the Toyota shop in Berthoud Co the dealers never sold them here! But people brought them in from Canada

You have to get the parts sent over from Japan through the dealer it's a nightmare because the US dealers know anything about them and usually order the wrong parts!

meanwhile you don't find out till months later when they arrive! Took us almost a year to get all of the parts to rebuild a 2L 4cyl non turbo diesel

That's the Toyota 2L diesel in your pic forced but ours had a turbo kit made for it hence the engine rebuild it melted the pistons!

let me start out by saying i have found my new home. this forum is just phenominal.

actually, they were imported to the states. check out fueleconomy.gov, click any year and any model, it will show you any and all engine and transmission combos that came available for that specific vehicle. back in the 80's, the two big players in the diesel car world were VW and Mercedes, but there were others too, Peugeot, Renault (the diesel engine offered in the XJ Cherokees) Isuzu, Toyota, Mazda was a VERY big player here too, with there 2.0L diesel being pretty popular (as far as diesel engine option sales went) in the Ford/Mercury Escort/Lynx and Tempo/Tracers, as well as their 626 and pick-ups. Lincoln even got in the game offering the 2.4L turbo diesel from the 524TD in the Mark VII and Continental for a year or two, Mitsubishi, Nissan/Datsun was pretty big too for awhile, GM obviously, Volvo... i think i got most of them... it was allowing the EPA to get the emissions laws passed that they did, as well as corporate cutting corners on Oldsmobile's ORIGINAL design (water seperator (lol) SIX head bolts per cylinder instead of four, higher volume oil pump, etc) of the 5.7L & 4.3L Diesel that ruined light duty diesel automobiles in the US, plus the prohibitive cost of maintaining alot of the above engines, as most repair shops dont want to touch diesels cause they dont know a thing about them

There's no replacement for displacement... except for the TURBO IN MY BASEMENT!Big Grin
12-01-2010 02:14 AM
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Silberpfeil Offline
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Post: #20
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
(12-01-2010 02:14 AM)AMCtilldeath Wrote:  There's no replacement for displacement... except for the TURBO IN MY BASEMENT!


I gotta ask---what turbo is that?

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(This post was last modified: 12-03-2010 09:03 AM by Silberpfeil.)
12-03-2010 09:01 AM
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glenlloyd Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
(09-12-2010 08:15 PM)ForcedInduction Wrote:  
(09-12-2010 08:06 PM)willbhere4u Wrote:  Evan Toyota never imported diesel over here to the US

Sure they did. I just saw one in Idaho Springs at the Phoenix Gold Mine.

You're right, they did for about 3-4 years IIRC. Here's a pic of a 2LT 2.4L diesel engine I used to have. The 2LT and its turbo variant were available in the states from 84-86 IIRC.

[Image: 2lt2.jpg]


Don't know anything about your van but if it's RWD I would get this one, already setup for same.

[Image: xd3tex.jpg]
(This post was last modified: 02-26-2011 09:35 AM by glenlloyd.)
02-26-2011 09:30 AM
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Waterloo49 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
id say a 4bt cummins if it will fit heighth wise
10-27-2011 02:10 AM
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MFSuper90 Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
(10-27-2011 02:10 AM)Waterloo49 Wrote:  id say a 4bt cummins if it will fit heighth wise

Besides the Cummins being heavy, that would make one bad ass van Big Grin

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10-27-2011 12:29 PM
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Waterloo49 Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Best 4 cyl for horsepower?
theres a 69 camaro running a 12v 6bt so the car should handle the weight of a 4bt
10-27-2011 01:29 PM
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